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Post by ayslyn on Apr 19, 2017 7:19:09 GMT -8
New article on Fantasy Flight's web page about the L5R LCG. Seven starting clans, Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion Phoenix, Scorpion, and Unicorn No more Force and Chi, instead you have a Military and Political stat Personalities cycle off the playfield as the game progresses via a Fate mechanic Two decks, functioning vaguely similar to those of the old game, however your Conflict (read Fate) hand is determined conflict to conflict via a bidding system. Story-wise, it''s set prior to the Scorpion Clan Coup, in an alternate timeline. There are a number of changes. Doji Hotori, son of Satsume and heir to the Crane, is now Doji Hotoru, daughter of Satsume, and heir, for example.... Edit for Linkage www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/4/19/legend-of-the-five-rings-the-card-game/
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2017 21:42:29 GMT -8
New article on Fantasy Flight's web page about the L5R LCG. Seven starting clans, Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion Phoenix, Scorpion, and Unicorn No more Force and Chi, instead you have a Military and Political stat Personalities cycle off the playfield as the game progresses via a Fate mechanic Two decks, functioning vaguely similar to those of the old game, however your Conflict (read Fate) hand is determined conflict to conflict via a bidding system. Story-wise, it''s set prior to the Scorpion Clan Coup, in an alternate timeline. There are a number of changes. Doji Hotori, son of Satsume and heir to the Crane, is now Doji Hotoru, daughter of Satsume, and heir, for example.... Edit for Linkage www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/4/19/legend-of-the-five-rings-the-card-game/A Crane man becomes a woman. Can anyone tell the difference? *Squints*
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HazelnutMudslide
Supporter
Posts: 129
Preferred Game Systems: L5R, 7th Sea, TriStat, WoD, D&D5e
Currently Playing: Nothing (LFG)
Currently Running: Nothing (LFG)
Favorite Species of Monkey: grease, never know when you'll need one to fix things.
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Post by HazelnutMudslide on Apr 20, 2017 11:26:03 GMT -8
Already set aside $120 for it, so stupidly hype, just hoping I can get at least one copy from friends who are going to Gencon.
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Post by ayslyn on Apr 20, 2017 18:52:32 GMT -8
I'm hoping to get mine at GenCon myself. Luckily, my brother and I play different clans, so we shouldn't be competing for cards too much, and can exist off the "one" complete set.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Apr 20, 2017 21:04:21 GMT -8
Now, here's a thing. I'd heard that Fantasy Flight's LCG concept was better than the CCG concept becuase it eliminated "pay to win" strategies. That is you don't have you buy packs and packs of booster cards, leaving you with dozens (hundreds?) of spares, to get the particular winning card combo you want. But then I read this:
So they are saying you can play with just one set, but if you want to win you need to buy three?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2017 23:19:18 GMT -8
Now, here's a thing. I'd heard that Fantasy Flight's LCG concept was better than the CCG concept becuase it eliminated "pay to win" strategies. That is you don't have you buy packs and packs of booster cards, leaving you with dozens (hundreds?) of spares, to get the particular winning card combo you want. But then I read this: So they are saying you can play with just one set, but if you want to win you need to buy three? Yeah. It's still pay to win, but now you are guarenteed to get certain cards in every pack. No gambling to try and get the ones you want. You will just know it takes X number of packs to get 3 of a card. Hopefully these cards will be clan specific and not generic, so that it is easier to trade with others who prefer to play other clans.
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Post by ayslyn on Apr 21, 2017 1:50:40 GMT -8
So they are saying you can play with just one set, but if you want to win you need to buy three? Not even remotely true. Not unless you want to lump mini's games into the idea of pay to win. It's the price to get the complete game. Pay to win means that you pay extra money to gain such a mechanical advantage that those who didn't pay up can't compete. That's not what happens here. That's not what happened with CCGs either. Does having more cards, and more rares give you more options? Of course. But having seen MANY highlander decks and rareless decks conquer to tournament scenes, I can happily say that they don't give you any sort of in(or nearly)surmountable advantage.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Apr 21, 2017 2:21:52 GMT -8
I'll take your word for it ayslyn. I can't get my head around these sort of card based games. Never have been able to. It's partly because of my own prejudice I know. There was a moment many years ago, when I thought Magic: the Gathering and its ilk was going to destroy the RPG hobby that I love. Now of course, I understand that actually my FLGS only exists because of CCGs, and without them would have gone bust many years ago. So I'm grateful for CCGs keeping the hobby alive in the bricks and mortar world. I even got a starter set of the old L5R CCG, after I was so impressed with its stand in, Romance of the Nine Kingdoms on the Gamers: Hands of Fate. But I still couldn't actually play it. Even now, I struggle to play Pokemon with my boy, and NEVER win. So it's part of the hobby I'll never understand fully. EDIT: though actually, now I've also read @stevensw's post, I'm less inclined to take your word for it. Especially since they say themselves "competitive players ... will require three core sets"
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HazelnutMudslide
Supporter
Posts: 129
Preferred Game Systems: L5R, 7th Sea, TriStat, WoD, D&D5e
Currently Playing: Nothing (LFG)
Currently Running: Nothing (LFG)
Favorite Species of Monkey: grease, never know when you'll need one to fix things.
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Post by HazelnutMudslide on Apr 21, 2017 3:29:30 GMT -8
I'll translate: Competitive players are the ones who attend tournaments hoping to reach national events.
While there's enough cards in a single box for two people to play and make a deck for whichever clan they want, competitive players don't like to have to swap cards between decks, so for some cards that the scene may seem "essential" buying 2-3 boxes ensures you have enough of those cards that you aren't constantly moving those cards between decks.
Where these newer LCGs have an advantage for players is that unlike Magic, Pokemon, YuGiOh, or even the old trek and Star Wars games (TCGs), you CAN get a "full set" in 3 core boxes, whereas TCGs are like baseball cards where you may have to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars (or trade...right) to get the cards you want for your deck.
It's like the RPG buy-in question, does this game require more than one book, and why would I want to buy all of them? ($10 savage worlds, vs 100ish for 5e)
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Post by ayslyn on Apr 21, 2017 3:33:30 GMT -8
Take my word, or don't. That's your choice. But, from being a part of the competitive scene for two ccgs for many years. They are unequivocally not pay to win. Accusations to the contrary ignore all the evidence.
Simply put, there are far, far too many wins by decks that either didn't have, or never saw the power cards for the pay to win argument to hold any real credibility.
Edit: And this comes from a player who routinely placed in the 1-X bracket at tournaments. I lost FAR more than I won.
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HazelnutMudslide
Supporter
Posts: 129
Preferred Game Systems: L5R, 7th Sea, TriStat, WoD, D&D5e
Currently Playing: Nothing (LFG)
Currently Running: Nothing (LFG)
Favorite Species of Monkey: grease, never know when you'll need one to fix things.
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Post by HazelnutMudslide on Apr 21, 2017 3:45:28 GMT -8
From my experience of hosting and running tournaments on local to regional level, in general I agree with you, that skill usually triumphs. However, I also saw top8-32's placings that were all several hundred dollar decks for MtG, YGO, and StarWars, as well as L5R/7thSea.
Might have been a localized mentality, however there was enough locally anecdotal evidence that when new sets dropped, kiddos with parents credit cards dominated for the first month until the grognards bothered to build counter decks for the new hotness.
Also, my point was more to the question of "how expensive is a complete set of cards?" - with Magic, these days, I would hazard $300-1000 if you bought boxes yourself and did no trading. That's not paytowin, that's pay to collect.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Apr 21, 2017 3:53:19 GMT -8
I lost FAR more than I won. Maybe you should have spent some more $$ I'm just joshing with you. I bow to your experience. And that of HazelnutMudslide
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HazelnutMudslide
Supporter
Posts: 129
Preferred Game Systems: L5R, 7th Sea, TriStat, WoD, D&D5e
Currently Playing: Nothing (LFG)
Currently Running: Nothing (LFG)
Favorite Species of Monkey: grease, never know when you'll need one to fix things.
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Post by HazelnutMudslide on Apr 21, 2017 4:02:50 GMT -8
I lost FAR more than I won. Maybe you should have spent some more $$ I'm just joshing with you. I bow to your experience. And that of HazelnutMudslideThe tl;dr - Fred, the LCG looks to be a lot of fun, it's pretty and $40 is a great buy in price, I would check it out just for those reasons alone. Can always use the cards as art for tabletop games too.
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Post by ayslyn on Apr 21, 2017 4:04:03 GMT -8
If only it were that easy. Amusingly, my best performance was with a remarkably rare light deck. And the rares that it did use were generally considered bad rares. They just happened to be really good for that specific deck. Additionally, I was a Pure player, so I intentionally "crippled" my deck by not playing tainted cards.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2017 22:27:01 GMT -8
If only it were that easy. Amusingly, my best performance was with a remarkably rare light deck. And the rares that it did use were generally considered bad rares. They just happened to be really good for that specific deck. Additionally, I was a Pure player, so I intentionally "crippled" my deck by not playing tainted cards. I prefer to think of it as playing on hard mode. Claiming to be better by using tainted cards would be like claiming to be better by playing a game on easy difficulty. Sure, you win the game faster, but in a less satisfying way. Placing constraints on your victory conditions is just one way to raise the bar and enjoy the challenge.
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