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Post by Probie Tim on Jun 17, 2017 20:41:09 GMT -8
So the other day I was talking to tyler about bring back one of our old games as a Roll20 thing. "D&D 5e?" he asked. "Nah, S&W. But I'd convert the PF class abilities you guys had," I replied. "Dammit, Tim," he said, "why do you like such old, clunky games?" he quickly retorted.* I went on to explain exactly why I like old, awesome games; ultimately, I said, what draws me towards older D&D versions and away from newer ones is the inherent "rules light" approach of the older versions. I'm not a big one for memorizing a lot of rules (my brain doesn't have as much space as it used to, after all) and newer D&Ds are much more "rules heavy". I want to spend my game-time actually gaming, not cross-referencing rule after rule. That said, I'd be lying if I said Tyler's comment didn't get me thinking. And D&D 5e has been lauded as the most "old-school"-like D&D to come out of WotC in years. So... why couldn't I run D&D 5e a bit more "old-school"-esque? D&D has always welcomed house rules, even EGG himself said so. Unless he was in one of his "no, you must play D&D strictly by the rules!" modes. Accurate time records, and all that. But I digress. Anyway, my thoughts started with Feats. They're already optional in 5e, so not using them is already built into the system. But what else would I have to do? How else could 5e be played more... paired down, more "rules light", and more old-school in playstyle? Let's discuss this. ~~~~~ * Not exact quotes. I'm paraphrasing.
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Post by lowkeyoh on Jun 17, 2017 22:01:51 GMT -8
Eject Skills and Proficiency, either completely or implement Background or Personality Proficiency. No codified skills, but you keep proficiency bonus. With background skills, anytime a character does something that they'd reasonably be proficient at due to their backstory they get to add their bonus. Derick Domino was a street punk before becoming a cop. Fast talking cops? Probably proficient. Diplomacy with the gang he used to run with? Probably. Bonus on Fast Talking a Corporate Middle Manager? Probably not. Bonus to car jacking, yes. Bonus to safe cracking, no.
With Personality Prof you write descriptive paradigms for your character. Derick Domino is Methodically and confidently disarming all adversity. Any time Derick is making a plan to out think and disrupt his opponents, he gets to add his bonus to ability checks. When improvising a plan, no bonus.
Either way, you strip the game to Ability Checks. All checks become d20+Stat with Proficiency on GMs approval. There aren't really many other 'rules' you'd have to keep track of. 5e is pretty striped down to begin with.
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 17, 2017 22:56:40 GMT -8
Drop the ability score increases by level as well (the alternative to feats) Roll for stats - ignore point buy Totally ignore CR when planning encounters Implement many of the options in the DMG for giving it an OSR feel, e.g. Longer healing/rest times. Ignore the magic item 'attunement' rules Aaron
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Post by lowkeyoh on Jun 17, 2017 23:03:13 GMT -8
Kainguru is absolutely right. Unless you're doing dungeon delves, lengthening rest times is a must.
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Post by uncommonman on Jun 18, 2017 0:43:04 GMT -8
Old adventure books and maps are a must. Classic "bad" illustrations gives a good atmosphere. And Old-school music while you play. Sagan om Ringen g.co/kgs/i5t6ek
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 18, 2017 1:18:17 GMT -8
Old adventure books and maps are a must. Classic "bad" illustrations gives a good atmosphere. And Old-school music while you play. Sagan om Ringen g.co/kgs/i5t6ek I absolutely fucking love that album - I bought a 2nd hand copy off a market stall for 50c when I was 14 - the sound track of many many old campaigns Aaron
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 18, 2017 1:27:16 GMT -8
Probie Tim : there is the elephant in the room - given the OSR games are now 'back in print' why convert if that's the feel you want? unless you intend to buy into the modules being released it seems a lot of work to convert stuff you may already have. I was going to relaunch my TOEE follow up campaign arc in 5e but opted to go 2e because that was the 'feel' I wanted, I have those books still and we'd already borrowed many of the clarifying rules from 2e for the 1e run (e.g.: I very early on adopted the 2e initiative/surprise systems because 1e initiative/surprise was a hot sticky mess) Also, TBH, I maintain Castles and Crusades is a better fit for having that OSR feel with modern rules - it's every bit as good as 5e just with a lighter touch rules wise. Plus it's no secret 5e was 'inspired' by CnC (i.e.: they nicked some ideas outright) Aaron
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Post by uncommonman on Jun 18, 2017 1:29:44 GMT -8
Old adventure books and maps are a must. Classic "bad" illustrations gives a good atmosphere. And Old-school music while you play. Sagan om Ringen g.co/kgs/i5t6ek I absolutely fucking love that album - I bought a 2nd hand copy off a market stall for 50c when I was 14 - the sound track of many many old campaigns Aaron I saw him live a couple of years ago and it was great. It was on a "progressive rock" festival in Stockholm.
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 18, 2017 1:36:14 GMT -8
I absolutely fucking love that album - I bought a 2nd hand copy off a market stall for 50c when I was 14 - the sound track of many many old campaigns Aaron I saw him live a couple of years ago and it was great. It was on a "progressive rock" festival in Stockholm. He played with Hendrix during his Europe tour - Hendrix's final tour Aaron
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 18, 2017 2:49:40 GMT -8
Back to 5e OSR Tinker with the races/classes. Restrict races to OSR core races and consider limiting PC access to certain classes if they are a demi human race. I'm sure there is a caveat to have an option to do exactly that within the 5e core rules Aaron
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Post by Probie Tim on Jun 18, 2017 8:50:39 GMT -8
Eject Skills and Proficiency, either completely or implement Background or Personality Proficiency. No codified skills, but you keep proficiency bonus. With background skills, anytime a character does something that they'd reasonably be proficient at due to their backstory they get to add their bonus. I was thinking something very much along those lines: my initial thought was to remove all that and pull in AD&D 2E's Secondary Skills, granting Proficiency on any Ability checks which could fall under the Secondary Skill. But 5e pretty much already has that covered with Backgrounds. Totally ignore CR when planning encounters Shit, I do that already. given the OSR games are now 'back in print' why convert if that's the feel you want? First off, I am a quintessential rules tinkerer; I enjoy tweaking and mucking about with rules. I'm sure I've spent more time hacking games and theorizing rule changes than I have actually playing any RPG. So looking at 5e and asking "what can I do to make it more rules-lite, make it more... my style?" is a fun thing for me. Beyond that, it's going to be interesting to see how many people will happily play a game called "D&D 5e Lite" but scoff at a game called "Swords & Wizardry" when they'll wind up being pretty close to the same thing, save the lack of a unified mechanic in the latter.
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Post by Kainguru on Jun 18, 2017 9:54:06 GMT -8
Ahhhh, a cunning plan - a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a ferret. Aaron
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