Playing a super-smart character, or similar
Feb 12, 2013 12:45:27 GMT -8
Post by tomes on Feb 12, 2013 12:45:27 GMT -8
I view dice rolling as a sort of 3rd party in RPGs... you have the DM who has created (or is managing) the scene and world, the players who are managing their characters, and the dice that manage aspects of the game that are decided outside of these two parties. Obviously the DM has a huge say in how much the dice play their part (does the DM decide the day's weather, or use the dice? does the DM decide if the player can open that locked door, or do the dice?) There is no right answer here, it obviously depends on the situation, DM, story, players, etc.
One subject that is related is the “how do you play someone smarter than yourself?” (is it even possible). The answer is ‘yes’, however it can only happen through both the players and the DM participating.
A story that might be pertinent here is the one Tappy mentioned long ago that happened to him in his youth: He had a DM which was a smooth talker, and his character was trying to convince some guard to let them through a door (or whatever), and although his character had high charisma, his player (himself) couldn’t do a good job with a convincing argument against this real-world charismatic, quick-witted DM. How could he play a character more charismatic or quick-witted than himself?
I don’t think this is any different than the way we play folks who are obviously much more combat skilled than ourselves… with dice and a good DM.
For example, in Tappy’s story, I would think a decent DM would do something of the following:
1. Let the player role-play it out FIRST. They do NOT need to have an argument or conversation that would convince me, in real life, to let them through… If the argument / role-play here is awesome, and the player did something really clever, then give them a bonus; if they said something they shouldn’t have or another obvious snafu, you can penalize them; note that I wouldn’t penalize them just for being someone in the real-world who isn’t quick-witted, just if they do an obvious fuck-up (accidently reveal the other characters are hiding around the corner, or they’ve killed the guys family, or something else they shouldn’t have said or done).
2. We would roll the dice out as you normally would. Depending on the system this is a charisma check, or perception, or intimidate, or whatever.
3. What happens next depends on the results:
SUCCESS: Even if the argument was weak, or this is a shy person trying an intimidate roll, you just story it so that it succeeds… for example: Let’s say Tappy’s trying to convince the guard to let them through, and all he could think to do is whine “please let us through”. Maybe you even give him a -2 to roll cause the argument he gave was weak or he didn’t role-play much. If he still rolls a success, then maybe the guard says “shit, you remind me of my son. Just go, but be quick. And if they find you, I’ll skin you myself.” He succeeded… and in this case his charisma, or luck, or skill, got him through somehow. Maybe the way he said “please” and the mannerisms got him (the character, not Tappy) through the situation. The story just matches the roll, as it does in combat.
FAILURE: In this case maybe Tappy gave a decent story, and rolled shitty. Maybe he is charismatic, but in this case the guard doesn’t care. Tappy can be a smooth-talker or handsome as shit, but if the guard doesn’t like smooth-talkers, or if he thinks Tappy reminds him of someone who robbed his family, then it’s all for naught, and the dice have decided thusly.
The extent to which they succeed or fail can also be decided. Succeeding by 1 point on the dice may mean the guard looks the other way and lets them through, but then later changes his mind and sounds the alarm saying they knocked him out (to cover his ass). Or succeeding with a high roll or critical success may mean that the guard is reminded of his son, tells them to go through and gives them some advice on how to avoid the next encounter.
Either way, the dice are deciding it. This is the same way we’ve heard stories of the guy rolling to see if his stupid character would be smart enough to figure out what his player has figured out. If he rolls low, he just doesn’t say anything cause his character wouldn’t have thought of it. This is the same thing, just the other way around… however it can only be successful with the DM’s help, since he is controlling the other side of this equation.
Are there other examples or situations that are similar to this that you’ve played or thought of?
One subject that is related is the “how do you play someone smarter than yourself?” (is it even possible). The answer is ‘yes’, however it can only happen through both the players and the DM participating.
A story that might be pertinent here is the one Tappy mentioned long ago that happened to him in his youth: He had a DM which was a smooth talker, and his character was trying to convince some guard to let them through a door (or whatever), and although his character had high charisma, his player (himself) couldn’t do a good job with a convincing argument against this real-world charismatic, quick-witted DM. How could he play a character more charismatic or quick-witted than himself?
I don’t think this is any different than the way we play folks who are obviously much more combat skilled than ourselves… with dice and a good DM.
For example, in Tappy’s story, I would think a decent DM would do something of the following:
1. Let the player role-play it out FIRST. They do NOT need to have an argument or conversation that would convince me, in real life, to let them through… If the argument / role-play here is awesome, and the player did something really clever, then give them a bonus; if they said something they shouldn’t have or another obvious snafu, you can penalize them; note that I wouldn’t penalize them just for being someone in the real-world who isn’t quick-witted, just if they do an obvious fuck-up (accidently reveal the other characters are hiding around the corner, or they’ve killed the guys family, or something else they shouldn’t have said or done).
2. We would roll the dice out as you normally would. Depending on the system this is a charisma check, or perception, or intimidate, or whatever.
3. What happens next depends on the results:
SUCCESS: Even if the argument was weak, or this is a shy person trying an intimidate roll, you just story it so that it succeeds… for example: Let’s say Tappy’s trying to convince the guard to let them through, and all he could think to do is whine “please let us through”. Maybe you even give him a -2 to roll cause the argument he gave was weak or he didn’t role-play much. If he still rolls a success, then maybe the guard says “shit, you remind me of my son. Just go, but be quick. And if they find you, I’ll skin you myself.” He succeeded… and in this case his charisma, or luck, or skill, got him through somehow. Maybe the way he said “please” and the mannerisms got him (the character, not Tappy) through the situation. The story just matches the roll, as it does in combat.
FAILURE: In this case maybe Tappy gave a decent story, and rolled shitty. Maybe he is charismatic, but in this case the guard doesn’t care. Tappy can be a smooth-talker or handsome as shit, but if the guard doesn’t like smooth-talkers, or if he thinks Tappy reminds him of someone who robbed his family, then it’s all for naught, and the dice have decided thusly.
The extent to which they succeed or fail can also be decided. Succeeding by 1 point on the dice may mean the guard looks the other way and lets them through, but then later changes his mind and sounds the alarm saying they knocked him out (to cover his ass). Or succeeding with a high roll or critical success may mean that the guard is reminded of his son, tells them to go through and gives them some advice on how to avoid the next encounter.
Either way, the dice are deciding it. This is the same way we’ve heard stories of the guy rolling to see if his stupid character would be smart enough to figure out what his player has figured out. If he rolls low, he just doesn’t say anything cause his character wouldn’t have thought of it. This is the same thing, just the other way around… however it can only be successful with the DM’s help, since he is controlling the other side of this equation.
Are there other examples or situations that are similar to this that you’ve played or thought of?