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Post by Kainguru on Jul 24, 2013 13:57:56 GMT -8
The usual progression is : masturbation, soggy Sao biscuit, sheep/cows and/or kangaroos depending on geography, vanilla, in a rather uncomfortable place like the back of a VW Beetle, back to the beasties, car-keys in fish bowl, gimp suit then your 18th birthday should be just around the corner . . . Sorry - but Soggy Sao is a private school game. You have to sub that out for shitshick depending on socio-economic background. I was the poor kid they let into a private school because I 'had potential' (my total lack of ambition being "that'll show 'em, watch me do absolutely nothing" rebellion). Thus I 'enjoyed' both sides of the muddy stream - shitstick at home with my neighborhood mates while knowing the posh kids at school played soggy Sao (never with me though, I was "too common" ) Aaron
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
Posts: 2,857
Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jul 24, 2013 18:21:01 GMT -8
So I have a question for the community...it is with great sadness that we mourn the loss of Stu's laptop apparently it committed suicide on some pavement last Saturday. My question is "What is the last sound it made before impact ?" I have a pretty good idea but curious what you all might think.
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merryprankster
Journeyman Douchebag
Posts: 243
Favorite Species of Monkey: Howler
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Post by merryprankster on Jul 24, 2013 22:50:27 GMT -8
"Goodbye cruel world"
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maxinstuff
Supporter
Posts: 1,939
Preferred Game Systems: DCC RPG, Shadowrun 5e, Savage Worlds, GURPS 4e, HERO 6e, Mongoose Traveller
Favorite Species of Monkey: Proboscis
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hjrp1007
Jul 24, 2013 22:58:02 GMT -8
via mobile
Post by maxinstuff on Jul 24, 2013 22:58:02 GMT -8
"STOP FUCKING TYPING ON ME!! ARE YOU WRITING A FUCKING BOOK OR SOMETHING??? FUCK IT - AAAAAAAAAAAAGHH"
*crunch*
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Post by CreativeCowboy on Jul 24, 2013 23:27:57 GMT -8
"What is the last sound it made before impact ?"
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Post by Kainguru on Jul 25, 2013 1:47:16 GMT -8
Hey!!! Saque P!!! 'Sit jou kop in die koei se kont en wag tot die bul jou kom holnaai' Aaron
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maxinstuff
Supporter
Posts: 1,939
Preferred Game Systems: DCC RPG, Shadowrun 5e, Savage Worlds, GURPS 4e, HERO 6e, Mongoose Traveller
Favorite Species of Monkey: Proboscis
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Post by maxinstuff on Jul 25, 2013 3:02:36 GMT -8
No no - it was a computer, so much more likely said something along the lines of:
"011010000111010001110100011100000011101000101111001011110111011101110111011101110010111001111001011011110111010101110100011101010110001001100101001011100110001101101111011011010010111101110111011000010111010001100011011010000011111101110110001111010100010001000101001011010011100001111001010011110011001101100110011011100100101000110100"
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Post by Kainguru on Jul 25, 2013 3:42:37 GMT -8
No no - it was a computer, so much more likely said something along the lines of: "011010000111010001110100011100000011101000101111001011110111011101110111011101110010111001111001011011110111010101110100011101010110001001100101001011100110001101101111011011010010111101110111011000010111010001100011011010000011111101110110001111010100010001000101001011010011100001111001010011110011001101100110011011100100101000110100" Which roughly translates out as . . . "the keyboard should be used with both hands otherwise my casing could get slippery and you might drop . . . " (crunch) Aaron
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mrcj
Journeyman Douchebag
Posts: 173
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Post by mrcj on Jul 25, 2013 5:54:43 GMT -8
Regarding converting player characters from one game system to another…
My guess is that is probably a pretty fast way to kill a game. I think Stork hit close to the mark. If players are emotionally invested in their characters and they are playing D& D or Pathfinder for example, starting at first level and now up a few. A portion of their enjoyment of the character is based in the mechanics, the mechanics of creation and then advancement, and plans for future advancement.
Certainly a portion of the experience is based in the role playing aspect, the personality players are able to create. But, when the underpinning mechanic is changed, the character recreated in the new system is a stranger with the same name.
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Post by bloodsparrow on Jul 25, 2013 6:53:13 GMT -8
I was chomping at the bit when they were talking about translating from one system to another. The most recent example of my experience was a campaign where I played a Bard that went from 3.5 to 4e D&D. I think the conversion went reasonably well. And I've converted characters from D&D to GURPS and from video games to GURPS or D&D.
My character is a persona that I create in my head, not just numbers on a paper.
Granted, in the case of the Bard, I could no longer cast signature spells like Tasha's Uncontrollable Hideous Laughter, but I think the flavor of the character's abilities were maintained.
Mostly because I was very involved in the conversion of the character from one system to another. The crunch monkey I went to for help (I went to the one I knew I could trust to take the character of the character into account) didn't just make the character for me. I built the character myself and then he provided suggestions on things I might not have read about or overlooked.
Whether you're going to start a new character at a high level or converting an existing character over to a new system you MUST be involved in the creation of your character. You need to look at the options available to you and make choices about which ones to take because then you're already thinking about how to use those, consciously or subconsciously.
If you don't do that then you're in for a rocky start.
Also, you wanted to simplify things so you changed TO Hero? ... I don't know much about Hero but even I know that seems a little counterintuitive.
On the subject of using a new system to the group at such a high level: I think you will want to take some time beforehand to run a series of sessions that are either outside of continuity or where the players are playing other people but with the same stats and starting at a lower level. Or maybe the same characters but lower-level and it's a flashback, or they're adversely affected by some situation... but a series of encounters or scenes where they are lower-level and can use just some of their new abilities. Then the next scene you jump it up a couple of levels and forward in time, and then the next session advance them even more levels... Until they're back to where they were roughly. You have to give them a chance to get into the groove of this new system.
We did this for a new player in my old group who didn't have a lot of experience playing tabletop RPGs and was nervous about her "performance" in the group of high level 4e characters. So I met with her and another friend. She created her character at level one and I dialed back my bard to a 1st level 4e Bard. The other friend created an encounter for the two of us to fight through and when we were done we advanced our characters a few levels and had another encounter. Next time we met we did had leveled them up a bit more and had another encounter and so on. It worked really well, also it was gobs if fun. When we sat down to play in the regular game for the first time with her she not only had a persona she was comfortable in but a character sheet she was well versed in.
You can skip this step of course, but you're either going to spend time with them sucking because they don't understand their new powers in this new system and risk the chance that they will get discouraged and want to stop playing, or let them suck for some time because they're lower-level... BUT they know this is temporary and the very next session there going to have more power and so on until they're back to where they were. They have a goal to shoot for as far as getting into this new system, so (possibly) less likely to get discouraged and quit the game.
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Post by CreativeCowboy on Jul 25, 2013 7:53:10 GMT -8
I was chomping at the bit when they were talking about translating from one system to another. The most recent example of my experience was a campaign where I played a Bard that went from 3.5 to 4e D&D. I think the conversion went reasonably well. And I've converted characters from D&D to GURPS and from video games to GURPS or D&D. My character is a persona that I create in my head, not just numbers on a paper. Granted, in the case of the Bard, I could no longer cast signature spells like Tasha's Uncontrollable Hideous Laughter, but I think the flavor of the character's abilities were maintained. Mostly because I was very involved in the conversion of the character from one system to another. The crunch monkey I went to for help (I went to the one I knew I could trust to take the character of the character into account) didn't just make the character for me. I built the character myself and then he provided suggestions on things I might not have read about or overlooked. Whether you're going to start a new character at a high level or converting an existing character over to a new system you MUST be involved in the creation of your character. You need to look at the options available to you and make choices about which ones to take because then you're already thinking about how to use those, consciously or subconsciously. If you don't do that then you're in for a rocky start. Also, you wanted to simplify things so you changed TO Hero? ... I don't know much about Hero but even I know that seems a little counterintuitive. On the subject of using a new system to the group at such a high level: I think you will want to take some time beforehand to run a series of sessions that are either outside of continuity or where the players are playing other people but with the same stats and starting at a lower level. Or maybe the same characters but lower-level and it's a flashback, or they're adversely affected by some situation... but a series of encounters or scenes where they are lower-level and can use just some of their new abilities. Then the next scene you jump it up a couple of levels and forward in time, and then the next session advance them even more levels... Until they're back to where they were roughly. You have to give them a chance to get into the groove of this new system. We did this for a new player in my old group who didn't have a lot of experience playing tabletop RPGs and was nervous about her "performance" in the group of high level 4e characters. So I met with her and another friend. She created her character at level one and I dialed back my bard to a 1st level 4e Bard. The other friend created an encounter for the two of us to fight through and when we were done we advanced our characters a few levels and had another encounter. Next time we met we did had leveled them up a bit more and had another encounter and so on. It worked really well, also it was gobs if fun. When we sat down to play in the regular game for the first time with her she not only had a persona she was comfortable in but a character sheet she was well versed in. You can skip this step of course, but you're either going to spend time with them sucking because they don't understand their new powers in this new system and risk the chance that they will get discouraged and want to stop playing, or let them suck for some time because they're lower-level... BUT they know this is temporary and the very next session there going to have more power and so on until they're back to where they were. They have a goal to shoot for as far as getting into this new system, so (possibly) less likely to get discouraged and quit the game. THIS^ So much as to bear the label "everything" depends upon the game's GM/authority and the players/authority. If the talk is simply levelled at a literary critique of a book, then yes. Matching one designer against another is like comparing two GMs. If the system is run as written within the book like a boardgame (meaning moving mechanical pieces: with a lack of GM input; attention to players needs; and consideration of the individual player's characters) then yes. Otherwise, THIS. ^
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2013 12:18:23 GMT -8
Like CC, I also dig Bloodsparrow's comments.
Quick thoughts on changing systems ...
I've done it at least three times and it never went well. In none of those cases did I do a full system introduction or transition period as Bloodsparrow suggests.
I think another cause was GM brain: Given that I'm permitted (even encouraged in some RPG tomes) to follow or ignore rules as I see fit, I saw the games primarily in terms of the story and characters and downplayed the influence of system as a variable in the equation of play.
I suspect that players, always constrained by rules, better understand and respect system as key variable in both character creation and in play.
Change the system and we are, quite literally, playing a different game. Maybe the transition can be successful if all recognize and accept this, but I'm then led to ask, "Why bother? Why not start fresh?"
Stu's remarks about finding and retaining a character's essence, etc. made me think of a comic book publisher responding to disgruntled readers following a continuity reboot:
Ha—they're both right!
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Post by guitarspider on Jul 25, 2013 13:21:57 GMT -8
Yeah, I believe especially in character creation system influences your choices a lot. While the character is not bound to the numbers on the page, it still was created with those numbers in mind, so porting a character means the character will never feel quite the same. There definitely are choices during chargen that only happen because system x gave me this idea/pushed me in this direction to flesh out my concept.
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Max Damage
Initiate Douchebag
Posts: 9
Preferred Game Systems: 5e, PbtA, Hero, Fate, Savage Worlds, Star Wars D6 & FFG, PDQ
Currently Playing: Savage Worlds
Currently Running: Savage Worlds
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Post by Max Damage on Jul 25, 2013 14:54:37 GMT -8
While the character is not bound to the numbers on the page, it still was created with those numbers in mind, so porting a character means the character will never feel quite the same. Absolutely agree that this is the fundamental challenge. The character will never feel quite the same. Rather than try to make them feel the same, whenever I've done this in the past, I'd work with the players to embrace that you get to take parts of your character that are familiar, the essence Stu discusses, but make them something new. Enjoy the new, enjoy what opportunities the new system provides for your character. As a GM, when I make a system switch, my best successes have been when we just went all out. We did this last year with a group of characters we loved playing. The characters (D&D3.5) were getting a little stale after 6 years, so we changed it up by going alternative universe using Savage Worlds and moving our characters, the Loose Collection of Adventurers (not to be confused with the Collection of Loose Adventurers), to a modern world A-Team genre. Our gnome paladin who rides his war boar into battle and fights for the little guy. Became a midget private eye who works pro-bono for worthy cases and drives a custom Harley, his Hog. Our Elf Sorceress pyromaniac, became a hacker arsonist that intended to burn down the evil in the world, through her keyboard magic or more conventional explosives, if necessary. The character relationships remained, providing a cohesive group from the first moment, but the new capabilities and challenges that we were able to explore breathed new life into the game.
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Max Damage
Initiate Douchebag
Posts: 9
Preferred Game Systems: 5e, PbtA, Hero, Fate, Savage Worlds, Star Wars D6 & FFG, PDQ
Currently Playing: Savage Worlds
Currently Running: Savage Worlds
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Post by Max Damage on Jul 25, 2013 15:01:40 GMT -8
As for Claire's comment that a character with the advantage of something like always has a weapon wouldn't be able to produce a weapon when naked, I think Brock Samson has a rebuttal.
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