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Post by squeatus on Mar 2, 2014 22:04:50 GMT -8
TL;DR: See Title.
I checked Obsidian Portal out a few years ago and thought it was pretty excellent for a wiki and had a LOT of promise but...looking at it now I'm just disappointed.
I just signed up today for an account (can't locate login info for the one I made in 2010-11) and just....WTF are they doing there?
If I try to locate games accepting players I get a google map full of pins that include abandoned shit from four years ago, if I filter by game system I get abandoned games with lots of fans. There's no easily identifiable filter or flag for games accepting players, or a way to look for online games for that matter. There's just a link to the google maps plugin for meatspace games.
I look at the campaign options, and while I'm *all for* a subscription model (those guys need to eat, or develop, or whatever) it's like, you subscribe and get their halfassed widgets, or you use the free option and essentially get a destructive wiki editor (no version control at all) and not even a calendar or chat options for players. More truthful advertising would be "A pared-down, zero-feature wiki with a lame wallpaper for free."
Their FAQ includes no information on successfully looking for groups, no way to filter based on activity if I want to become a "fan" and follow an ongoing campaign...
Case in point: Searching for GURPS I found Stu's Eldemy game featured prominently, and using a more popular system I found a Hellfrost Savage Worlds game from 2011 as one of the top results. I can't even kibitz on there successfully because I can't find frequently and/or recently updated campaigns with any consistency.
Instead of invigorating me with the opportunity for some good online play, all I see is a collection of dead campaigns.
It's like being assaulted with every aborted idea and non-starter campaign in the history of RPG's at the same time.
I really like the *idea* of Obsidian Portal, but there's got to be a better solution than the one they're providing. AFAIC, they've regressed.
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snoman314
Journeyman Douchebag
Posts: 225
Preferred Game Systems: GURPS
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Post by snoman314 on Mar 2, 2014 23:09:17 GMT -8
Yeah I've never thought to use Obsidian Portal to look for new games. I've only ever used it to manage games with players I found via other means. To be honest I didn't realise that OP had a 'looking for game' section. And yes, when it comes to using it to manage a campaign, it leaves a lot to be desired.
I'm hoping Realm Works is going to be better when it comes out.
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Post by squeatus on Mar 3, 2014 3:43:05 GMT -8
Yeah I've never thought to use Obsidian Portal to look for new games. It just seems that a community of hosted games would have a way to look for games. I understand the point of it initially was to provide a hosted game management tool, but it sure seems from the look of it to be trying to be a lot more like a hub for gamers and GM's. I mean, they've got Google Maps for locating games, "Lonely Gamers" integration to help gamers and GM's find others, Google Analytics included in the paid plans; all presumably for GM's to get the word out to gamers so they can connect with one another... ...then it's like, there's no way to actually fucking find anything when you get there. A few years back there appeared to be a lot of visual cohesiveness, and that seems to be missing now as well. It's just all kludgey and weird. It just looks like a site that's on autopilot. Plug in a few social buttons and use some google API shit and charge monthly subs... bleh.
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snoman314
Journeyman Douchebag
Posts: 225
Preferred Game Systems: GURPS
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Post by snoman314 on Mar 3, 2014 4:07:03 GMT -8
To be honest, I haven't really been on there since they started the whole re-build thing. Sounds like it didn't go well.
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
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Post by D.T. Pints on Mar 3, 2014 14:47:13 GMT -8
The mobile ap version of OP is an improvement, the interface of adventure log has been really helpful. All four campaigns I'm running are in one place. Three of the games I'm a player in are easily accessible in the same place. It is far from perfect but for me it is the shiniest thing going... I wouldn't use it to find games though. Use roll20 and G+ and they'll probably tell you if you're interested here's our OP page. Like here's my OP page... the-awakening-of-the-desert-king.obsidianportal.comIf there's something better id love to hear about it.
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Post by squeatus on Mar 3, 2014 22:06:38 GMT -8
The mobile ap version of OP is an improvement, the interface of adventure log has been really helpful. All four campaigns I'm running are in one place. Three of the games I'm a player in are easily accessible in the same place. I'll check out the mobile app and see about that. Too bad they missed the boat entirely on locating games, though. Seems like that would drive traffic > subscriptions > improvements. Checked out your campaign already when you linked to it in Friday's show thread, actually signed up for it again after checking out your powerslave campaign. I think I'm all ranty because the potential seems to be there, it's just like, OP seems to *miss* it almost deliberately.
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
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Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Mar 3, 2014 22:56:45 GMT -8
Absolutely! I was very excited for the reforged and really wanted it to be an easier tool to use...and it is but not by much. Yeah they missed the boat on having be an ACTUAL DRIVER of getting more people to game and there are thousands of campaigns people start and then never do jack shit with. However the campaigns of the month...ARE PRETTY AMAZING. And take shit tons of work and also require some players to give a fuck. Which is often a tall order... So yeah I paid the 35 or whatever dollars I use it all the time, but it could be VASTLY better...if something better comes along I will definitely be an early adopter. If you're not too keen on the webpage I doubt the mobile app will make you feel any better . Its just something I use all the time and my players can chime in exchanging player Gm secrets and such. I love me some Maiden! My wife loves the Homer X-ray! . Cheers. Curt.
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Post by ayslyn on Mar 3, 2014 23:07:32 GMT -8
It's not that the missed the boat, as it is that it's not what they wanted their site to be about...
It's not like there aren't a bunch of ways to find games already.
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Post by squeatus on Mar 4, 2014 2:53:10 GMT -8
It's not that the missed the boat, as it is that it's not what they wanted their site to be about... It's a portal for games. I mean, "find a game" should be the first thing you see on their navigation menu. That game finding feature should also not suck. Failure to acknowledge the utility of a game search is sort of like being that jackass fireworks trailer owner in Joe Dirt who only sells snakes and sparklers. I could open a store called "Pizza Portal" and provide a bunch of tables and chairs, then tell all my walk-ins that we don't actually make any food, but that would be what some might consider a missed opportunity.
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Post by ayslyn on Mar 4, 2014 10:08:20 GMT -8
It's not a portal for games. It's a portal for campaigns. There's a difference.
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maxinstuff
Supporter
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Post by maxinstuff on Mar 4, 2014 12:16:12 GMT -8
So can anyone describe what these missing features are that are the holy grail of campaign management so I can build it and swim in nickles.
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
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Post by D.T. Pints on Mar 4, 2014 20:34:15 GMT -8
OP needs a forum much like this one in it to better organize all the conniving PvP secrets that really make for a meaningful campaign...oh and accurate time records.
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Post by squeatus on Mar 5, 2014 0:19:20 GMT -8
It's not a portal for games. It's a portal for campaigns. There's a difference. Campaigns are games, so I'm not quite following you. I mean, I get that you want the problem space of OP to be "campaign logs" and not "campaigns and finding them." If you look around the site, though, it seems they've spent a great deal of time trying to connect people to games. They've just abandoned those features varying states of half-assedness. Looking at the prominently displayed menu bar, maybe it's the section that says "Campaigns" -- a feature where you browse other campaigns and can filter by "Looking for Gamers"--but not really, because the Looking for Gamers "filter" is actually a button that takes you to an entirely different service: the google map service. Or perhaps it's the "Games Nearby" where you can use the same google map service to zoom in to about a 10x10 mile area and drag around the country til you find a game (you can't really "see" all the games in larger views) -- this may not be the ideal way to attack this problem that they're apparently not interested in working on anyway. Oh, it could be in the "Community" (that's web 2.x for forum) button that includes a sticky thread by an administrator on how to find a game (it's like four years old, and links to "features" like a recursive campaign of campaigns, hosted by a user, which was abandoned years ago) At this point, since there's no obvious way to get back out of the forum (which looks like an entirely different site) most new users would probably give up. I mean, I hope you can at least see how it might appear to someone new to the site that they supply features which would connect gamers, at least based on their administrator posts, the pronounced placement of said "LFG" services, and the "social-networky feel" they're going for. I mean, I guess Facebook could have stopped with a "It's a place where you post stuff so other people can read it, but it's not about finding other people to communicate with." I just don't know if it would have gone over as well.
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Post by squeatus on Mar 5, 2014 0:21:39 GMT -8
So can anyone describe what these missing features are that are the holy grail of campaign management so I can build it and swim in nickles. I don't know, really. I'm a consumer, not a campaign portal designer. Consumers don't always know what they want. With OP I don't think it's missing features, it's just horrendously broken ones. Like "looking for gamers" filtering in the "Campaigns" section, which apparently is for browsing but not searching, as far as I can tell.
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Post by Kainguru on Mar 5, 2014 3:24:55 GMT -8
OP needs to built similar to some aspects of Roll20 - navigation needs to be more intuitive and campaign forum sub section should load a standard forum style interface (why reinvent the wheel - forums work well as process of design evolution then you get the OP forum and basically 'WTF"). Character sections should be more than just a block of text: a customised form, with titled subsections, would be better - for a start I'd move PC/GM secrets to the TOP so they can be seen more easily. The whole lot needs more unifying - changes in one sub section should automatically update similar references in others. maxinstuff - get coding . . . Aaron
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