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Post by HourEleven on Jun 22, 2015 11:26:38 GMT -8
I just witnessed an interesting online argument about single player single GM games. One person arguing they are great and one arguing they are crap.
Wondering what you all's experience with them is and your opinion on the matter.
Some of the points brought up:
Pros --------
1. Able to delve very deep into a single character because they don't have to share the spotlight.
2. No compromise in the type of game (mood, theme, combat vs RP percentages, etc) because it only has to fit one player's taste.
3. No inter-party fighting to kill whole swaths of a session.
Cons ---------
1. It's not "real" role playing gaming without the community of the group.
2. If the player hits a spot where they are stumped there's no other player to help them get out.
3. Breaks a lot of "tank/healer/DPS" systems without GM PCs.
4. No interparty fighting to create great RP moments.
5. It's awkward and weird.
------------------------------
I personally have had some great experiences GMing one and one games. They are very different from 2+ player games, but not in a bad way, in my opinion. But I could also see how it could get weird, or break down with a passive player or rail roady GM.
Thoughts?
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bevinflannery
Journeyman Douchebag
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Post by bevinflannery on Jun 22, 2015 15:46:50 GMT -8
I think (and of course my opinion is the right one!) that it's a big "it depends." It depends on the player, and the GM. I've run long-term single-player games that worked out great. I've run shorter single-player games that were "meh." I've been the player in both. I'm very much on the pro side of the table here. As for the cons:
1. Bullshit. If two players in a larger group can "role-play" by having conversations or side-quests separate from the larger group, one GM and one player can "role-play," too.
2. Stumpiness isn't limited to the single-player situation, though I do agree that the more brains you have working on problems the more creative solutions those multiple brains will come up with. That said, I've also seen (both as GM and player) many many occasions where six players have been stumped and at a loss for how to attach a problem, requiring the GM to direct some brain-storming and drop the clue-hammer on our heads. The clue-hammer is equally available in a single-player game.
3. The single-player game I've been running for the past 7-8 years is 3.5, very much in the tank/healer/DPS dynamic. I just don't have encounters that can't be overcome without the Checklist o' D&D archetypes; when the player wants to make sure he has support to fill a role his PC doesn't have, he has a stable of NPC friends/allies he can call on -- but he typically goes solo. Now, if I wanted to run lots of encounters that depended upon having all those roles filled, then a single-player game probably wouldn't work ... but the system can certainly be used without that matched set.
4. Well, I just use the NPCs to piss the player off. And our tabletop group, frankly, is so adverse to intra-party conflict that there's not much opportunity for long-simmering conflict among them, try as I might to pit them against one another.
5. Meh. I guess it could be, but that one-on-one action is no more awkward and weird than the role-play orgy.
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Post by HourEleven on Jun 23, 2015 13:29:14 GMT -8
I agree with all of your points completely. I don't think there's any problem a good GM can't solve.
As for the tank/healer situation, I ran a single player pathfinder game for ages and just required the player to split-class and used the gestalt multi classing rules from the core book (you pretty much get ALL the bonuses from all classes) it makes for a "full party character" pretty quick and they take on some serious challenges single handed.
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bevinflannery
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Post by bevinflannery on Jun 23, 2015 16:36:42 GMT -8
I agree with all of your points completely. You are a wise and insightful fellow.
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Post by heavymetaljess on Jun 24, 2015 15:11:05 GMT -8
5. Meh. I guess it could be, but that one-on-one action is no more awkward and weird than the role-play orgy. Came here to give my 2 cents but bevinflannery put it perfectly. My single player game is with my girlfriend so that might be why it's never been awkward or weird - but why would you have a one-on-one game with someone you aren't super comfortable around?
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jeffrywith1e
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Post by jeffrywith1e on Jun 24, 2015 19:43:07 GMT -8
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Post by muntjack on Jun 28, 2015 8:07:43 GMT -8
My better half and I have done the one gm/one player thing. It has led to some really fun, engaging roleplay (not THAT kind, you perverts).
We've each run a game, Exalted and Mouse Guard. I'm a seasoned GM, but not so much for my better half. It was a less intimidating way to learn the craft of GMing. Also, my once meak, baker mouse has gone on to do amazing things, including a glorious moment of decapitating an owl in one amazing dice roll moment.
I say give it a shot, especially with someone you trust who is new to the hobby!
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D.T. Pints
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jun 28, 2015 8:20:12 GMT -8
The demands on the player are much more extreme. My wife really enjoys our Star Wars game but she gets to play a monotone halting speech droid (she doesn't feel her improv skills are very sharp, and she's wrong). But that game has SEVEN! (ack!) players and she can often get time to consider her next move or statements. When asked to play a character going solo(bolo-Comedy Bang! Bang! fans) she finds the pressure to always be ON stage to take away from her enjoyment. But, one on one game moments are really vital for our gaming group. Taking a player aside for ten minutes when they have wandered off really ramps up everyone's immersion and tension. To then run a two hour "solo" session and then come back to the group with a huge "I know something you don't know" vibe is utterly priceless. All of those counter arguments feel pretty straw man to me. A system defense is just silly. Just don't create such lethal encounters that are dependent on a "balanced party". The inter-party conflict ? I would agree, but then the GM should do a better job of creating such conflict with vibrant and interesting NPCs. Like a mad scientist that tortures vampires to find a cure for influenza... muntjack .
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Post by HourEleven on Jun 28, 2015 19:47:29 GMT -8
I've done the "solo with a group" a decent amount, but usually in the format of WoD "preludes" where you play sections of each character's lives before the games plot begins. Helps a lot with that first awkward session where everyone is figuring out their character and everyone else's at the same time by having them already comfortable in the skin of their own character. I've never solo side barred like you described, though. Sounds like a good idea.
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daniel
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Post by daniel on Jun 29, 2015 4:17:49 GMT -8
I would say it just needs a different kind of game, also being comfortable enough with the the person for it not to be made weird. If thats a problem even after talking about it, maybe don't do it is the best idea.
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Post by muntjack on Jun 29, 2015 4:31:19 GMT -8
Sidebars are a normal thing for our group, especially when we're running less combat-heavy games. I can think of a specific game that azuretalon ran in Exalted where sidebars were the norm. Mostly because he was playing all of our Dragon Blooded characters against one another the entire time, but doing do brought about an amazing end to one of our all time favorite games. If you do the sidebar thing, I'd suggest leaving the other players that are left out something to consider if you don't want to break the immersion of the game. Then again, if it's at a point where you've been playing for a few hours and need a break, it could be a good moment for others to stretch, snack, use the restroom, etc. And D.T. Pints, that sounds like a great NPC! :-)
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Post by HourEleven on Jun 29, 2015 7:03:18 GMT -8
D.T. PintsAlso, seven players? Holy crap. I hate going over three players, 4s the largest table I ever ran. I here about these giant games and can't even imagine.
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jun 29, 2015 7:36:15 GMT -8
Yep, if it were a super crunchy game like Mathfinder it would probably be waaay to much. But this is my "The Miserable Gamers" group that spawned out of our Les Miserable production last year. So I have some highly entertaining drama loving bastards that I often can sit back and enjoy a delightful argument between: - a glamorous Wookie seeking the galaxies greatest hair relaxer
- a Kel Dor smuggler who's voice translator is on the fritz so he switches between a bad eastern european accent, a bad Sean Connery, and an even worse Bostonian
- my lovely wife playing the creepiest of droid doctors
- a Zabrak bounty hunter that just wants to be in his bunk with his gun but refuses to shut the door so everyone can hear him
- torgruta explorer who is slowly being taken over by her cybernetics thanks to above doc droid
- her sister that won the captaincy of the ship The Lady A Majora (newly christened) by cheating at gambling with the original captain
- the original captain, the lone human who suffers from short term memory loss but is actually a wealthy sociopath
And somewhere in the midst of all this chaos we still manage to get a story going. Its been a great game. And each has had several sessions of side bar time so that they all have an individual story line going on behind the scenes that will hopefully be revealed one day. The easiest way for us to accomplish these solo stories has been to have a phone text conversation to establish story, characters etc. Then at the table (at the actual fucking gaming table mind you, which is my first long running in person game in years they will get notes and than be pulled aside for a brief conversation. My hope is that some time soon we will have several opportunities for each character to have their own solo (quasi prelude) session. Fun stuff!
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Post by heavymetaljess on Jun 30, 2015 6:16:11 GMT -8
D.T. PintsAlso, seven players? Holy crap. I hate going over three players, 4s the largest table I ever ran. I here about these giant games and can't even imagine. Tried to start a 4 player game at a game store... ended up with 9... it was the first time DMing for people I didn't know personally. I wanted to kill myself. They all had fun, but I didn't. Now I have a "never again" attitude and have a hard cut off at 4 players.
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Post by ericfromnj on Jun 30, 2015 11:48:23 GMT -8
Seen isn't all that bad if you have those GM popcorn moments like D20 seems to have where they just rp the heck out of a situation.
We did it with a D20 variant and it was still fun.
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