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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2012 7:54:50 GMT -8
Has anyone Savaged Dark Heresy/Watrhammer 40K? I HATE playing 40K, but I LOVE the fluff of the game universe - and have a couple grand in figures and rule/army books... I haven't played Dark Heresy because I'd have to deal with people in the local 40K group and most of them are just douche bags (not in a good way). Thumbing thru the Deluxe book, specifically the sections on Making Races, Hindarences and Edges there is just about everything to remake various racial cultures and abilities; I'm betting the weapons are or could be covered as well... Maybe if I get laid-off next month I might have some time to do this myself... Here's hoping for a severance package to give me a little wiggle room!
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kevinr
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Post by kevinr on Mar 24, 2012 10:20:20 GMT -8
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2012 12:18:43 GMT -8
Awesome!
I had already downloaded a bunch of stuff from that site, but I totally overlooker the 40K stuff - thanks!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2012 13:28:47 GMT -8
I played a short 40k:dark heresy campaign in savage worlds, the system is perfect for it, we didn't even use a conversion.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2012 17:19:37 GMT -8
I like the character creation matrix I found off the link from KevinR, there is some really good 40K fluff driven stuff in there.
For the most part, if you know the 40K fluff, the SW rules cover just about everything to run the players as Imperial Guard troopers....
But creating villains and henchmen might take a bit of time. I might try to take a stab at statting out some gene stealers and maybe a lictor... Probably tomorrow while doing the laundry.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2012 7:41:35 GMT -8
We actually played as Inquisition agents, I had a psycher (AB(psionics)) and another player had a techpriest (AB(weird science)) with a chainsword. We started as seasoned so we were strong enough.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2012 16:33:38 GMT -8
I've been working on converting the 40K miniature stats to SW and it's flowing REALLY easy!!! I know one of the downloads on that other site had weapon stats in it and I was going to use them, but it's so easy to just cross them over as a similar existing SW weapon! The Tyranids are going to be tough, but the Tau battle suits are going to be stupid easy!!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2012 18:16:50 GMT -8
If you are having issues with Space Marine power level, you could look at the Super Powers Companion. I am currently running a Necessary Evil game (same ruleset as SPC) and I really like the way the Powers are handled. You should probably limit the use of most powers, but a novice Super with the Power Point system is really "street level/mutant" power level range. I don't think that is far off from a Marine (high toughness, strength) not to mention the Powers have a battle suite mechanic built in. Worth considering
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2012 16:39:31 GMT -8
Right now I only have the Deluxe core rulebook and Weird War II book...
So far things have been going well - except for the perpetual disctraction from work!! To cross-over 40K figures as NPCs I did an Excel file listing the straight stat lines of IG, SM, Tau and Tyranids and converting them to SW with a 40K value of 3 being equivalent to a SW d4; few 40K attirbutes go over a 6, which translates to a d12, so it's not until I try to do SM Chapter Masters that I am going to hit major hurdles.
Converting weapons took a little bit of creativity, but I have most of them done. Tyranids are going to be a pain, but I think Edges and Powers are going to be the key.
I started working on PC builds today, I'm sticking with just IG, SM and Tau as playable characters - I don't like Eldar. I'm looking at IG troopers being built straight by the SW book, Tua will be mostly by the book with attribute caps and Marines are starting with jacked up attributes and an extended Vigor to d20.
I'm going to give select Edges for free to generate the 40K fluff; like Brawny for Marines and Band of Brothers for bonded Fire Warriors.
For the Marine power armour I am leaning toward the Power Armor (battle suit) in the Deluxe book. For the Tau battle suits I am leaning toward Power Armor (heavy suit) in the Deluxe book. I think this will give me a good comparison of size and armor value versus toughness and Armour Save.
Dreadnaughts are going to be a problem; it's technically a living being encased in a walking tank...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2012 17:38:26 GMT -8
Rather then go to a D20 you could have D12 +x. This is how the Super Powers are handled once you get to D12..I think it makes sense because it keeps the dice sizes down yet gives you a flat bonus at a certain point..which is pretty nice imho Cool deal deal us informed! I have all the 40k book, but only ran/played one game. I don't mind the system too much (other then it being classed based) but I like SW much more. Edit: I also think they did it this way to keep the chance of Acing decent. At a D20 you won't ace hardly at all.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2012 16:36:58 GMT -8
I was thinking about this earlier today, rather than focusing on work... :-( The d12+x keeps with the base system, but I'm not sure how large "x" should be.
I see the point about the d20 being harder to Ace, but to an extent that is part of the point and why I only considered it for Vigor. You'll get generically higher values just because the statistical average is higher and the 5% of the time you DO Ace, your numbers will be STUPID high!!! While this would be completely broken in a normal SW game, it fits the fluff of 40K really well... These guys are 8'-0" tall and proportionally large like a pro wrestler/body builder, live to fight and are genetically and physically altered to regenerate close to automatically and be all but invulnerable to every toxin in the universe. If you permit that into something like Fighting or Shooting, it makes sense fluff wise but starts to REALLY break the system... And if you permit it into Strength, a wounding roll could do 4 or 5 wounds from Aces and raises = broken... Fluffy, but broken...
I'd like to post some of what I have, but GW is rabid about protecting thier IP and I don't want to board to ge in trouble; or they could just delete the post.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2012 17:24:03 GMT -8
I've got a bunch of stuff converted and organized, but it's all in a vaccuum at this point.
Here are some of my thoughts: Imperial Guard character build guidelines: • Build a character as usual. • All Guardsmen get the following equipment automatically: o Laser Rifle with Bayonet o Kevlar Armor +with Inserts o Helmet o Standard infantry field kit Backpack Bedroll Mess kit 2 full uniforms o Any specialize equipment will be issued on a mission critical basis.
Space Marine character build guidelines:
• All Traits start at a d6 and build normally from there. • Vigor starts at d8 and can be increased to d20. • Marines get the following Edges for free automatically o Brawny o Harder to Kill o Martial Arts o Rapid Recovery o Strong Willed • Marines may never take art, philosophy or wealth oriented Edges. • Marines get the following kit automatically: o Bolter o Powered Armor +(battle suit) o Sword (dagger by scale)
Tau Fire Warrior character build guidelines:
• Vigor can never be higher than d10. • Fire Warriors get the following kit automatically: o Pulse Rifle or Pulse Carbine o Composite Battle Suit with Helmet
Here are some of the NPCs in my Beastiary: Human (Soldier), Storm Trooper Attributes: Agility d6, Smarts d6, Spirit d4, Strength d6, Vigor d6 Skills: Fighting d6, Knowledge (Battle) d6, Shooting d8, Intimidation d4, Notice d6, Taunt d6 Pace: 6; Parry: 5; Toughness: 4 Gear: Hellgun, Bayonet, Backpack Special Abilities: • Armor +6: Infantry Battle Suit • Danger Sense: grants a Notice roll at -2 immediately before a surprise attack, ambush or other surprising event. • Nerves of Steel: may ignore 1 point of wound penalties • Tough as Nails: +1 Toughness • Combat Reflexes: +2 to Spirit rolls when recovering from Shaken.
Human (Soldier), Sanctioned Psyker Attributes: Agility d6, Smarts d6, Spirit d4, Strength d6, Vigor d6 Skills: Fighting d6, Knowledge (Battle) d6, Shooting d6, Intimidation d4, Notice d6, Taunt d6 Pace: 6; Parry: 5; Toughness: 4 Special Abilities: • Arcane Knowledge (Psionics) – any combination of powers up to 6 points
Kroot, Vulture – Vultures have resurrected the avian ancestry of the Kroot species. Their wings are not suited for extended flight, but allow them to spiral on warm updrafts above the jungle canopy and then swoop down upon the heads of their enemies.
Attributes: Agility d6, Smarts d8, Spirit d4, Strength d8, Vigor d6 Skills: Fighting d8, Knowledge (Battle) d8, Shooting d6, Intimidation d4, Notice d8, Piloting d6, Stealth d6, Survival d8, Taunt d8, Tracking d8 Pace: 6; Parry: 6; Toughness: 4 Gear: Kroot Rifle, Frag Grenades, Dagger Special Abilities: • Armor +2: Leathery skin • Flight • Low Light Vision: Ignores penalty for Dim and Dark lighting. • Woodsman: gain +2 to Tracking, Stealth and Survival rolls in wilderness. • Size +1: Kroot are up to 3 meters tall
Tau (Warrior), Shas'vre Body Guard in XV82 Battlesuit - The XV8 Crisis Battlesuit provides several advantages to a Fire Warrior wearing it. It increases the strength, endurance, toughness, and armor of the wearer. It also has hard points to attach weapons and support systems. It also incorporates a Jetpack into the design, which allows for greater maneuverability and flexibility on the battlefield. It also supports many upgrades to further increase its versatility on the field of battle. Attributes: Agility d6, Smarts d8, Spirit d6, Strength d10, Vigor d8 Skills: Fighting d6, Knowledge (Battle) d8, Shooting d8, Intimidation d6, Notice d8, Piloting d6, Taunt d8 Pace: 8; Parry: 5; Toughness: 9 Gear: Drone Controller (accompanied by up to 2 allied Drones of any type), XV82 Battlesuits may be armed with any 2 of the following in any combination: • Burst Cannon • Flamer • Missile Pod • Plasma Rifle • Fusion Blaster Special Abilities: • Armor +10: Power Armor (battle suit) • Common Bond: may share Bennies • Flight: XV82 Battlesuits have a Flying Pace of 12” and a Climb of 0. • Sensors: XV Battlesuits are equipped with a sensor package that grants the following abilities: o Infravision/Low Light Vision: Ignores penalty for Dim and Dark lighting. o Alertness: +2 to Notice • Steady Hands: Ignores unstable platform penalty, Running penalty reduced to -1. • Large: Attackers add +2 to their attack rolls. • Size +5: XV8 series Battlesuits are a humanoid shape 5 meters tall and 2 meters wide.
Tyranid, Genestealer - A Genestealer is a species of Tyranid used as the ultimate shock trooper. Their purpose is to advance ahead of a Hive Fleet and pinpoint potential planets for the Tyranids to devour. They are amongst the most deadly creatures in the Galaxy, combining high cunning, lightning-fast reactions and movement, with large, extremely sharp claws that can rip through the toughest armor in seconds.
Attributes: Agility d12, Smarts d12, Spirit d4, Strength d8, Vigor d8 Skills: Fighting d12, Knowledge (Battle) d12, Shooting d12, Intimidation d4, Notice d12, Piloting d12, Stealth, Taunt d12, Tracking d12 Pace: 6, Parry: 8, Toughness: 4 Special Abilities: • Number Appearing: 1-12 • Armor +: Chitin Exoskeleton • Fleet of Claw/Wing: +2 to Pace, use d10 for running • Wall Walker: no change to Pace even when crawling along walls or ceilings • Arcane Background (Biomorphs) o Feeder Tendrils (as Stun) or Flesh Hooks (as 2pt Blast) • Arcane Background (Weapon Symbiotes) – Genestealers may have one of the following: o Rending Claws (2 pair): Str+d8, AP 2 o Rending Clays (Str+d8, AP 2) and Scything Talons (Str+d8 with Two-Fisted Edge) • extra pair arms
Tyranid, Carnifex - Carnifexes are hulking, powerful Tyranid creatures used as living battering rams. They are often armed with the most powerful Tyranid Bio-weapons, and are used in shock assaults, spaceship boarding actions, massed battles, and for battering through fortified positions and tank formations.
Carnifexes are not very intelligent and in fact have little self-awareness. They will revert to unthinking rampages of destruction if not constantly supervised and guided by the Hive Mind. All Carnifex species seem well able to adapt to extremes of environments from arctic cold to desert heat.
Attributes: Agility d12, Smarts d12, Spirit d10, Strength d12, Vigor d12 Skills: Fighting d6, Knowledge (Battle) d12, Shooting d4, Intimidation d10, Notice d12, Piloting d12, Stealth, Taunt d12, Tracking d12 Pace: 8, Parry: 5, Toughness: 5 Special Abilities: • Number Appearing • Armor +10: Chitin Exoskeleton • Huge: Attackers add +4 to their Fighting and Shooting rolls when attacking due to the Lictors size. • Fearless: immune to Fear and Intimidation • Arcane Background (Biomorphs) – a Carnifex may have any combination of the following: o Adrenal Glands: as Quick Edge – redraw initiative card if dealt 5 or lower, continue drawing until receiver higher than 5. o Bio-Plasma: as Counter Attack Edge – free fighting attack to adjacent foe who failed a fighting attack at -2 o Enhanced Senses: as Farsight – range penalties halved o Flesh Hooks: as 2pt Blast o Mace or Scythe Tail: as Sweep Edge o Regenerate: fast Regeneration - +2 to Spirit rolls to recover from Shaken, permit Vigor roll each round to to heal a wound. o Spine Banks (count as frag grenades) or Spore Cysts (release Spore Mine Clusters) o Thorn Back: as Deflection o Tusked: as Lance • Arcane Background (Weapon Symbiotes) – a Carnifex may have any two of the following: o Barbed Strangler o Crushing Claws (can’t double) o Devourer, Linked o Deathspitter, Linked o Lash Whip: as 2pt Entangle o Rending Claws: Str+d8, AP 2 o Scything Talons: Str+d8 with Two-Fisted Edge o Venom Cannon
Tyranid, Hive Tyrant - Hive Tyrants are monstrous Tyranid creatures created to be commanders of the Tyranid swarm. They embody the Hive Mind completely and act as the primary Synapse conduit through which it enforces its will over lesser Tyranid creatures. Hive Tyrants are extremely powerful, large and strong monsters three times the height of a man that can tear through plasteel or ferrocrete as if they were glass. They excel in both close combat and ranged fighting, and in fact every part of their body is perfectly designed to maim and kill. They are highly mutable, with individual Hive Tyrants display a wide range of physical characteristics, biomorphs, and bio-weapons.
Attributes: Agility d10, Smarts d12, Spirit d10, Strength d10, Vigor d12 Skills: Fighting d10, Knowledge (Battle) d12, Shooting d6, Intimidation d10, Notice d12, Piloting d10, Taunt d12, Tracking d12 Pace: 8, Parry: 7, Toughness: 5 Special Abilities: • Number Appearing 1 • Armor +10: Chitin Exoskeleton • Huge: Attackers add +4 to their Fighting and Shooting rolls when attacking due to the Lictors size. • Fearless: immune to Fear and Intimidate • Arcane Background (Biomorphs) – a Hive Tyrant may have any combination of the following: o Adrenal Glands: as Quick Edge – redraw initiative card if dealt 5 or lower, continue drawing until receiver higher than 5. o Bio-Plasma: as Counter Attack Edge – free fighting attack to adjacent foe who failed a fighting attack at -2 o Enhanced Senses: as Farsight – range penalties halved o Flesh Hooks: as 2pt Blast o Toxic Miasma: as Deflection o Wings – grants Flying Pace of 12” and a Climb of 0. • Arcane Background (Weapn Symbiotes) – a Hive Tyrant may have any two of the following: o Barbed Strangler o Deathspitter, Linked o Devourer, Linked o Lash Whip (as 2pt Entangle) & Bonesword (as Great Sword) o Rending Claws: Str+d8, AP 2 o Scything Talons: Str+d8 with Two-Fisted Edge o Venom Cannon • Arcane Background (Hive Mind Powers) – Hive Tyrants have Horror (as Fear) and one of the following: o Scream: as Banish o Warp Blast: as 6pt Blast o Warp Field: as Armor
Alot is just numeric conversions and copy & paste from fluff wikis...
I want to get the feel of the universe without just swapping the core rules system. 40K is all about having an army of 20 to 200 models on the table... I want to have a group of players experience what the individual soldiers are dealing with.
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HyveMynd
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Post by HyveMynd on Apr 3, 2012 22:15:51 GMT -8
Looks good so far silvester10596, though I've only scanned. I'll have to give it a closer look when I get home from work tonight. I couple of things stood out to me though.
First are the character classes/races balanced with each other? I mean, I know that the Adeptus Astartes are giant 8' tall super-human warriors created from the Emperor's own genetic stock with acidic saliva, two hearts, and a partially organic black carapace on their skin that let's them interface with power armor, and what not. But if you make them so much more bad ass than the Imperial Guardsmen and Tau Firewarrior then no one will ever choose the "sucky" options. This is one of the reasons (I think) that Fantasy Flight Games made their Inquisitor, Deathwatch, and Rogue Trader games separate books and games, even though they are set in the same universe and use the same system. I've got the books at home in PDF format, and they listed the amount of XP you'd have to give a Rogue Trader or Inquisitor PC so that they were on par with a starting Adeptis Astartes PC. It was a lot.
I would either make all the players in your group chose the same character type, or find a way to balance them a bit more.
Also, sot to be one of those guys but I don't know if I would make a rule saying that Adeptus Astartes character can't take Philsophy or Art based Skills or Edges. Have you read any of the Horus Heresy novels put out by GW? I was skeptical at first, since the Warhammer 40k miniatures game depicts the Space Marines as being pretty one-dimensional. But they're actually pretty decent books, and they prove that individual Space Marines are just as varied as "regular" people. Some of them would be great artists and philosophers.
Lastly, as an old Tyranid player I don't think Genestealers and Carnifexes should have such high Smarts. They're animals driven by the will of the Hive Mind, and revert to normal, animal level intelligence when outside it's influence. Tyranid Warriors, Lictors, and Hive Tyrants would probably have a decent Smarts score, but not the little grunts or mindless heavy weapon platforms. Also Taunt? For a Carnifex? And Stealth? Really?
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Post by jazzisblues on Apr 4, 2012 6:00:29 GMT -8
I have but with a cursitory eye o're looked the articles in question ...
Do you have any hindrances applied to any of this? It's totally ok if you don't, but I tend to look for things to balance out presents I give to characters.
Another thing that leaps to mind is that if one elevates EVERYONE to having a d6 for all starting traits then it could have been left at a d4 because while everyone would be succeeding slightly less often everyone will be succeeding on the same % scale. ie. If everyone succeeds only 30% of the time it doesn't matter that they're not succeeding 50% of the time.
Something I've discovered over the years of gaming is that if I start elevating everyone either by giving them higher stats, or more abilities or more presents. All I really end up doing is elevating the whole thing which at first doesn't seem like a bad thing, but what I've seen is that it ends up giving the characters noplace to grow to.
Just a few thoughts as I was reading. I really like what you're doing. Looking forward to seeing how it plays out.
JiB
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 7:22:50 GMT -8
@hyvmynd - After a brief WHY paragraph, I STRONGLY advise GM's to NOT permit mixed parties. Marines kill xenos on site and really have nothing but contempt for "normal" humans. I agree that Astartes are soo much more enticing than IG because of the great starting stats, but I honestly only put them in because I'm more of a completist... - I HATE Marines, I hate the "SuperMan" aspect of them, I LOVE Love luv IG!! They everyday man raising up to the situation and doing the best he can!!
I read the first 3 books of the Heresy series and then I lost interest - don't like marines... The Heresy era Marines were very introspective and that seems to have lead to thier downfall in many cases - my mind was more on the "modern" era marines when I wrote in the "no philosophy" bit and I agree that they are very 1 dimensional and that is part of why I don't enjoy them.
I read the first 11 Gaunt's Ghosts books and lost interest after the short story that blinds Gaunt. And after finally accpeting that they really are all the same book with the names changed to turn a profit...
I agree about the Smarts values. I used 40K Leadership as SW Knowledge (Battle) to backfill SW Smarts; I'm open to a better stat match.
I tried to take out the obvious skills and what not that Tyranids don't have, looks like I missed a couple. I think you're right, not only should Nids NOT have Taunt, they should probably be immune to Taunt and Intimidation.
@jib - the main reason to start Marines higher is to reflect the advances over "normal" human and keep them as potential PC's in line with them as NPC's. It's possible that normal humans would be fighting against enhanced human - IG fights Traitor Marine and vice versa.
I haven't decided if I want to convert the various vehicles or not...
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