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Post by xaphanos on Oct 19, 2016 9:40:05 GMT -8
It's been about 10 years since I've GM'd. So I'm beyond rusty. I may be in over my head and I'd like some advice.
I started gaming in the 70's with the original three D&D books even before high school. Moved to AD&D through the 80s. kind of lapsed once real life gained traction, and fell into sporadic games. Always with close friends. I always GM'd. My last game was about 10 years ago when I ran through a classic module series. I picked up with the podcast in season 7, and feel I've learned a lot - even without any actual play.
Now we're older (I'm over 50, everyone's over 40), and I just got rooked into running a game again. Over the years, I've kept notes for games I might run "someday". We have chatted about what we'd all like and the game is shaping up like this:
Near epic-level high magic high-fantasy with a bias toward Nature characters. Rangers, Druids, etc. Centaurs, Sprites, and similar for characters. Multi-class, probably. Six players. My hook concept is the usual "save the universe from total destruction at the hands of indifferent and malicious gods". I plan to use D&D 3.5 because the players are most familiar with it and there are more resources to tap into. There will be quite a bit of inter-planar movement as they try to lose pursuers and gain attention of those that can (and are willing to) assist. Wrapped up in strong elemental setting trappings, an Avalon-ish "Plane of Forest", and hopefully some PLAYER-PERSONAL themes to grab their emotions (grief, life's purpose, one's legacy - we're all old, remember?). I expect to run 4-8 sessions before the climax where they attempt to stop and restart the Wheels of the World.
Some of the players are used to being coddled rules-wise - "What do I roll for damage?" "Do I have a spell to climb that wall?" - but are excellent at role-playing. Some are a LOT more experienced. All seem to be on-board for a character-driven collaborative storytelling experience. I warned them all that I will not tolerate min-maxing and rules-lawyering.
I am fighting with my tendency to write the ending, but not very well. My current climax involves a full party split - one character to handle each aspect of the problem. Followed by a choice whether to ascend into immortal godhood, or return to the world to live and die as the person they were born to be. I am working towards the best practice of having "scenes" set up without solutions. I have almost a dozen so far. And a few maguffins.
I know this is a bit of a train-wreck. Epic is hard to pull off with any kind of balance and/or risk. Having been out of things for a while makes me uncertain of whether my improv mind is swift enough to yes-and my way through this with finesse. I need some confidence that this is at all possible - or if I should "wave off" and go with something less ambitious.
So... Advice?
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sbloyd
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Post by sbloyd on Oct 19, 2016 9:41:57 GMT -8
The problem with starting at Epic or nearly so is that your players don't have time to grow accustomed to or to develop a bond with their characters.
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Post by xaphanos on Oct 19, 2016 10:19:02 GMT -8
The problem with starting at Epic or nearly so is that your players don't have time to grow accustomed to or to develop a bond with their characters. Agreed. I plan to counter that somewhat with a few methods: - Slow, involved chargen. I plan to have full sessions with nothing but backstory and character interlinking. I NEED allies and enemies from their past to draw on to plan where to send them to get maguffins and clues - and to pursue them. The hunters are hunted...
- Flashbacks. During the main action, I intend to insert relevant backstory into the plot. "Why didn't you shoot?!" "Because all those years ago, the Doomsinger told me this day would come..." and let the player riff on that for 10 minutes or more. I want storytelling, and I think every player can do this quite well...
- Player emotional hooks. I plan to tap into my knowledge of my friends psyches. (One has reconciled with children from a first marriage, one has a bit of impostor syndrome in real life, one is young(er) and often feels ignored) I will go easy on the mind games, but I DO plan to make this a story that is relevant to each of us.
Do you have other methods to add character bonding?
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sbloyd
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Post by sbloyd on Oct 19, 2016 10:28:30 GMT -8
Are you familiar with Fate character generation? It specifically has hooks for interweaving PCs into each others' backstories.
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Post by xaphanos on Oct 19, 2016 10:38:31 GMT -8
Are you familiar with Fate character generation? It specifically has hooks for interweaving PCs into each others' backstories. Only through listening to the podcast. I intended to bluff my way through chargen, but I will take your implied suggestion to use Fate's methods in a more formal way. Or should I just abandon D&D 3.5 and use Fate? A lot of time and effort on my part - between learning it myself and then teaching it to them as we play. How worth it would it be? I think I have enough on my plate...
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sbloyd
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Post by sbloyd on Oct 19, 2016 11:42:14 GMT -8
They're totally alien systems. I wouldn't. I just feel like having a broad range of systems knowledge is beneficial, because you can cherry-pick ideas from each. Basically, characters in Fate are built upon tags called Aspects. Aspects are things that are, narratively, always true; also, they can be used in particular ways to get bonuses on die rolls (or have penalties inflicted). For example, my core aspect might be "Paladin" - so I am a paladin. You then pick aspects that relate to your 'trouble' ("Alcoholic" or "Zealot" or "Fae-Blooded" might be good choices) and other facets of your character. You also have parts that are specifically set aside for aspects that describe your history with one or more other PCs. You and I might be playing a paladin and a mage, and figure out a piece of backstory where we worked together to foil a bunch of demon cultists, and I might create an aspect "Stands Against The Darkness" based on how that story worked out (I held off the cultists and their demon familiars while you frantically enacted the ritual to banish them, maybe; maybe you would get "Banisher of Darkness" while we're at it). How this might fit into 3E? No idea. Unless you specifically build in Aspects into it, and let your players 'tag' those aspects for die roll bonuses (We're fighting against a horde of undead, and they are threatening to overtake the party! But remember that time I was able to "Stand Against The Darkness"? +x to my saving throws this scene! Woo!). Anyhow... Fate isn't necessarily less crunchy than 3E, it's crunchy in different ways. I ran a Dresden game for the better part of a year, and to be honest, I was still fuzzy on how everything worked by the end
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Post by xaphanos on Oct 19, 2016 12:32:47 GMT -8
Yes. I will plan to have some hybridization of the rules. I already planned to houserule the magic system to simplify its usage. I'll be reading the details on aspects to get them wedged into chargen. Thanks.
Any other suggestions?
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sbloyd
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Post by sbloyd on Oct 19, 2016 12:35:48 GMT -8
You could also do some flashbacks to build characters' backstory, especially if you ever have times where not everyone can make it to the game. If Dave can't make it, but Tim and Tyler and Laura show up, maybe run a flashback to an earlier adventure that was just between Tim, Tyler, and Laura.
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Post by Forresst on Oct 23, 2016 3:26:39 GMT -8
Man, this sounds like... you know how sometimes when you're both hungry and grouchy and you buy a pizza and then you try to put 3 slices together and call it a pizza sandwich and then you choke? Well, I suppose that's the literal version of biting off more than you can chew... so yeah, sounds a lot like that.
I'm not saying it's a bad idea. It sounds like a fantastic setup. But oh man I would not do this if someone put 3 pieces of pizza in my hand and told me to get eating.
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sbloyd
Supporter
WHAT! A human in a Precursor service vehicle?!
Posts: 2,762
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Post by sbloyd on Oct 23, 2016 5:28:03 GMT -8
Now, TWO pieces? Sure thing!
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Post by xaphanos on Oct 23, 2016 6:32:47 GMT -8
Man, this sounds like... you know how sometimes when you're both hungry and grouchy and you buy a pizza and then you try to put 3 slices together and call it a pizza sandwich and then you choke? Well, I suppose that's the literal version of biting off more than you can chew... so yeah, sounds a lot like that. I'm not saying it's a bad idea. It sounds like a fantastic setup. But oh man I would not do this if someone put 3 pieces of pizza in my hand and told me to get eating. Yeah, I get it. In the old days I was really good at going with those "left turns", and folks really enjoyed the flexibility. I was also more prone to violating rule zero in favor of obeying the rulebook back then, so I think I'm able to bluff my way through this better than I ever did before. The group are all VERY old friends, and if it falls flat, there won't be any bad feelings - we'll fall back to some old-school dungeon crawl module for a few sessions until I get my chops back.
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Post by uncommonman on Oct 23, 2016 6:47:19 GMT -8
Now, TWO pieces? Sure thing! Or one of these:
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Post by zoomfarg on Oct 23, 2016 6:57:08 GMT -8
... we'll fall back to some old-school dungeon crawl module for a few sessions until I get my chops back. Why not start with this? That sounds great. If the module spreads over more than one session and you get bored of it, who cares? It will have been just your warm up. It will not have been the project you really care about. (Also, fuck you English your future perfect tense.)
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Post by xaphanos on Oct 29, 2016 3:15:38 GMT -8
... we'll fall back to some old-school dungeon crawl module for a few sessions until I get my chops back. Why not start with this? That sounds great. If the module spreads over more than one session and you get bored of it, who cares? It will have been just your warm up. It will not have been the project you really care about. (Also, fuck you English your future perfect tense.) Probably good advice. I think I'll see how the chargen goes before I decide on this, though. They already know the setup and "mood" I'm trying to achieve and are super excited, so a strategic retreat before even trying will be disappointing for everyone. If the chargen / backstory sessions fall flat, I think I'll wave off in favor of a one-shot to buy a few weeks of extra warm up.
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Post by chronovore on Nov 13, 2016 15:51:52 GMT -8
Are you familiar with Fate character generation? It specifically has hooks for interweaving PCs into each others' backstories. Only through listening to the podcast. I intended to bluff my way through chargen, but I will take your implied suggestion to use Fate's methods in a more formal way. Or should I just abandon D&D 3.5 and use Fate? A lot of time and effort on my part - between learning it myself and then teaching it to them as we play. How worth it would it be? I think I have enough on my plate... It's possible that I'm simply projecting, but I took sbloyd 's comment to mean use FATE's character background mechanic just to establish the characters if nothing else. He mentions "cherry picking," and that's exactly what this is. I like the collaborative background development so much, I will be including it wherever I can. If nothing else, it may help your players get in better touch with characters who are starting far along.
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