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Post by RudeAlert on Aug 6, 2017 11:10:35 GMT -8
Hey! You guys are bigger on the screen! Woot woot!
Stu, I so frikin agree with you on not being a dick GM, it's really annoying when you forget something as a PLAYER but the GM punishes your CHARACTER for it. I have been in that situation and that sucks! It ruins the enjoyment and also feels really stupid in-game, like "What do you mean my character forgot his mother's name!?!?! I swear I have it on a note somewhere I just can't find it right now!!!"
To address the statement from Kimi that reminding the players of stuff their characters should remember isn't necessarily the GM's job. I agree that it's not the GM's job or responsibility per se, but there's no harm in erring on the side of not being an ass to the players and throwing them a bone every once in a while, especially if something hasn't actually come up in the actual game in a long time. So it's not the GM's job, but it's still a nice, helpful thing to do.
And regarding the spinning plate syndrome, I feel like if the players/characters haven't addressed something for a while, instead of throwing more stuff at them, it would be better to simply recycle what has already been established and bring it up again, and possibly make it progress along so that it feels like the world is living around the characters.
As for using props to help players remember in-game events. I have a bit of a funny story regarding the failure of props to accomplish this task. In a game I played in years ago, at some point the GM had our characters find a note from one Kobold clan to another about a big meeting they were going to have to plan an invasion of our home town, and the GM even gave us a prop note... which we ended up completely forgetting about. So we went on our merry way the very next session and never went to warn the town. Months later, in real time and game time, our characters are in a totally different part of the world and we stumble on to the chief of the guard from our home town. He was ragged and exhausted, so we asked him what was going on, and he told us that he'd been sent to find help to retake the town from an army of Kobolds that had invaded it. We all sort of looked at him and lamely replied something like: "Oh no! How terrible! Whoever could have seen THAT coming? ....." So yeah, even props don't always help, but it can still be funny. Though I do kinda feel that it would have made more sense for the GM to remind us when it became obvious that we'd forgotten about the note, since it was pretty ridiculous for our characters to forget something so important. Also, our game sessions were generally quite irregularly spaced so I believe a lot of time had passed between the session were we found the note and the next one.
Also, "bi-weekly" has the unfortunate problem of also being bi-meaning in that it means both twice a week AND once every two weeks. Semi-weekly on the other hand, only means once every two weeks.
Regarding the "dice fudging" thing from the last email, I don't know that I would qualify that as dice fudging, it's more an alternative to NPC stats and health tracking, which I'm totally in favor of. I decided a while back that making full stats for NPCs and monsters is not only tedious and boring but also a giant waste of time. Non-PCs don't need a full set of stats, they only need a bare-bones version that is suitable for the GM to adjudicate things fairly and consistently. So I simplify the crap out of NPCs and monsters, down to the most basic useful numbers and skip all the extraneous details.
And Stu, yes, FUN!!! I feel like too many people lose sight of what GAMES are about. Everyone has their own preferences for what they find fun, but in the end "fun" is and should be the ultimate goal; you're not often going to get much else out of a game anyways.
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Post by uncommonman on Aug 7, 2017 1:43:32 GMT -8
Regarding the "dice fudging" thing from the last email, I don't know that I would qualify that as dice fudging, it's more an alternative to NPC stats and health tracking, which I'm totally in favor of. I decided a while back that making full stats for NPCs and monsters is not only tedious and boring but also a giant waste of time. Non-PCs don't need a full set of stats, they only need a bare-bones version that is suitable for the GM to adjudicate things fairly and consistently. So I simplify the crap out of NPCs and monsters, down to the most basic useful numbers and skip all the extraneous details. I hate dice fudging but I agree to some degree in the non stated up NPC's. But something you all seem to forget is what about the PC's chance to get injured? If a combat is already resolved you don't need to roll dice but if the combat is still a danger to the PC's I think it is "cheating" to end it prematurely. You can resolve this different ways if you still feel a need to speed up the combat, for example: let one or more PC's take a hit before ending the combat. And I don't think it's wrong to change stats for NPC's if you have made a mathematical mistake, the NPC's is still as powerful as you imagined.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Aug 7, 2017 9:35:48 GMT -8
Also, "bi-weekly" has the unfortunate problem of also being bi-meaning in that it means both twice a week AND once every two weeks. Semi-weekly on the other hand, only means once every two weeks.
Fortnightly! Fortnightly! Fortnightly! We give you American's a language, and you 'simplify it,' getting rid of perfectly harmless "u"s and "ugh"s, which I can live with if not admire. But then you get rid of a perfectly serviceable word for two weeks, "fortnight" and tie yourself up in knots with whether bi-weekly means twice a week or every two weeks. Bah. Hopeless.
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Post by ayslyn on Aug 7, 2017 10:44:06 GMT -8
Also, "bi-weekly" has the unfortunate problem of also being bi-meaning in that it means both twice a week AND once every two weeks. Semi-weekly on the other hand, only means once every two weeks.
Fortnightly! Fortnightly! Fortnightly! We give you American's a language, and you 'simplify it,' getting rid of perfectly harmless "u"s and "ugh"s, which I can live with if not admire. But then you get rid of a perfectly serviceable word for two weeks, "fortnight" and tie yourself up in knots with whether bi-weekly means twice a week or every two weeks. Bah. Hopeless. /throws his hands up Preach Brother!!!!
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Post by Probie Tim on Aug 7, 2017 11:17:21 GMT -8
Yeah. Like I'm going to let anyone who pronounces the letter "Z" as "zed" talk to me about language.
...
I'm kidding! Kidding I say!
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Post by vyrrk on Aug 7, 2017 11:21:56 GMT -8
My favorite quote from this show... "Why are you torturing your players with game mechanics?" -Stu
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Post by OFTHEHILLPEOPLE on Aug 7, 2017 12:17:04 GMT -8
Sounds like Stu is fighting a Broodlord in his Ipad Spacehulk game. I've been playing a lot of the "Spacehulk: Ascension" game on Steam and, allow me to say, fuck Broodlords.
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sbloyd
Supporter
WHAT! A human in a Precursor service vehicle?!
Posts: 2,762
Preferred Game Systems: Storyteller; Dresden; Mage
Favorite Species of Monkey: Goddamnit, Curious George is a CHIMP not a monkey! Stop teaching my daughter improper classification!
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Post by sbloyd on Aug 7, 2017 13:35:59 GMT -8
My favorite quote from this show... "Why are you torturing your players with game mechanics?" -Stu Isn't that what they're for?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2017 15:48:53 GMT -8
Also, "bi-weekly" has the unfortunate problem of also being bi-meaning in that it means both twice a week AND once every two weeks. Semi-weekly on the other hand, only means once every two weeks.
Fortnightly! Fortnightly! Fortnightly! We give you American's a language, and you 'simplify it,' getting rid of perfectly harmless "u"s and "ugh"s, which I can live with if not admire. But then you get rid of a perfectly serviceable word for two weeks, "fortnight" and tie yourself up in knots with whether bi-weekly means twice a week or every two weeks. Bah. Hopeless. Correction: As has been said before, American English follows other languages down dark alleys and rolls them for words.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2017 15:58:21 GMT -8
On the 'fudging' -- I don't feel it's a 'cheat', but I do feel this is a house rule you need to discuss or just implement with full knowledge of the players. Anecdotally, some players like to keep track of damage done/dealt/initiative etc as a sort of scoreboard. For instance, in a 1e L5R game, I did 78 damage on a straight katana hit outside of a duel. Seikuro got a 44 on an honor roll - not bad for 2 dice.
On the plate spinning: I think something cooperatively between players and GM has worked out for me, as in the group recaps with the GM stepping in to correct details or remind as needed. As a player, I have trouble remembering even in in-depth, involved games. Two stories:
1) First time in a new group. About six months in, I've been in-character abusing another character, refusing to learn his name, always calling him 'dwarf'. In all fairness, my character was a prick who knew one day, someone would be stronger than him and just kill him. We go to an outer plane to commune with the 'dwarf''s ancestor, who had notoriously in history drowned the world in blood. It's an orc. And I was seriously confused like 'Why is your ancestor an orc?!' And everyone was stunned because they thought I called him a dwarf to be an ass. No, as a player, I somehow missed the detail about him being a half-orc.
2) An L5R game. An Akodo trained at the Kakita Dueling Academy, on a warrior pilgrimage, so he's undercover as a ronin. His goal is to perfect his Kakita technique. We meet in a new town where we're going to be the magistrates. Keishu goes to the dojo and challenges the school, to test his skills. Round one, I thrum a couple guys, round 2 I outduel the next best, round 3 hand to hand against the sensei's best student, a beautiful female Crane. So, we grapple and Keishu rear naked strangles her, she won't tap out, and passes out. Sensei fights me and knocks me damn silly. Fast forward awhile. We're travelling with a female Crane we suspect is a spy. We hatch this great plan to seduce and impregnate her, figuring it'll make her have to go home. I insist, being of a bully-ish demeanor, Keishu should do it to protect everyone else's honor. People were confused, "It'll never work". I asked why and then my friend said "Remember the Crane girl you knocked out at the dojo? That's her, dumbass." Ooops.
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Post by akavidar on Aug 7, 2017 17:32:55 GMT -8
Fortnightly! Fortnightly! Fortnightly! We give you American's a language, and you 'simplify it,' getting rid of perfectly harmless "u"s and "ugh"s, which I can live with if not admire. But then you get rid of a perfectly serviceable word for two weeks, "fortnight" and tie yourself up in knots with whether bi-weekly means twice a week or every two weeks. Bah. Hopeless. Correction: As has been said before, American English follows other languages down dark alleys and rolls them for words. Hey, what can I say? We're borrowers.
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Post by ayslyn on Aug 7, 2017 17:55:01 GMT -8
Deny the foul heresies contained within the Book of Webster!!!! Only the true light of Oxford can bring you grammatical salvation!!!!oneone
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Aug 7, 2017 22:59:45 GMT -8
I worry that Stu Venable may be conflating, or the team/chatroom may be confusing him about, Warhammer versions. He talked early in the episode about wanting to get a Warhammer RPG. He followed that up mumbling about needing "something to do with those minis I'm buying, I got that new Dreadnought..." Somebody pointed out that there's a new edition of WFRP announced, and there is: cubicle7.co.uk/cubicle-7-and-games-workshop-announce-new-edition-of-warhammer-fantasy-roleplay/But, I think Stu Venable is looking for Warhammer 40k, the futuristic setting, He might be better looking for old stock, or trying a PDF of one of those games: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000_Roleplay I can't say I recommend the system, played a game of Deathwatch once, it was the GMs first time as GM, but even so I wasn't that impressed with the system.
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Post by uncommonman on Aug 8, 2017 1:16:32 GMT -8
I worry that Stu Venable may be conflating, or the team/chatroom may be confusing him about, Warhammer versions. He talked early in the episode about wanting to get a Warhammer RPG. He followed that up mumbling about needing "something to do with those minis I'm buying, I got that new Dreadnought..." Somebody pointed out that there's a new edition of WFRP announced, and there is: cubicle7.co.uk/cubicle-7-and-games-workshop-announce-new-edition-of-warhammer-fantasy-roleplay/But, I think Stu Venable is looking for Warhammer 40k, the futuristic setting, He might be better looking for old stock, or trying a PDF of one of those games: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000_Roleplay I can say I recommend the system, played a game of Deathwatch once, it was the GMs first time as GM, but even so I wasn't that impressed with the system. I think he should just buy lore books and use GURPS. Here's a reddit thread about that: www.reddit.com/r/gurps/comments/2up2fj/warhammer_40k_universe_in_gurps/
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 1:56:22 GMT -8
I worry that Stu Venable may be conflating, or the team/chatroom may be confusing him about, Warhammer versions. He talked early in the episode about wanting to get a Warhammer RPG. He followed that up mumbling about needing "something to do with those minis I'm buying, I got that new Dreadnought..." Somebody pointed out that there's a new edition of WFRP announced, and there is: cubicle7.co.uk/cubicle-7-and-games-workshop-announce-new-edition-of-warhammer-fantasy-roleplay/But, I think Stu Venable is looking for Warhammer 40k, the futuristic setting, He might be better looking for old stock, or trying a PDF of one of those games: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000_Roleplay I can say I recommend the system, played a game of Deathwatch once, it was the GMs first time as GM, but even so I wasn't that impressed with the system. Yeah I think Stu Venable is looking for 40K rather than Warhammer Fantasy based on his description but unfortunately all those games are currently out of print / license so there is no legitimate way to get the PDFs and the print books are going for ridiculous prices online. I think Deathwatch is a bad example of the system, being space marines the characters have an excess of abilities from the start while the focus of the game doesn't really give many options beyond just killing things. I think Deathwatch doesn't really work beyond dungeon crawls in space though I still want to play it as the conclusion to a Dark Heresy campaign. Have the PCs start out as inquisitorial agents, uncover the massive conspiracy / xenos invasion then have to call in the heavy guns of the space marines to save the day.
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