D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
Posts: 2,857
Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jul 22, 2013 21:15:45 GMT -8
True. But I thought the original plan was to flatten him with a flying walrus. It WAS! But I kinda felt bad about being the one with all the weird ideas. I didn't want to be the showboat, you know? Every time I opened my mouth, both you and DT would let your heads fall (sometimes in unison) and laugh for a second. I'm kinda proud of "so you take 5 damage as a javelin sticks in your side." "well, I pull it out and throw it back." That shit was EPIC! My favorite was the shape shifting water moccasin and then bite the fucker INSIDE his armor. Totally bad ass!
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
Posts: 2,857
Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jul 22, 2013 21:30:48 GMT -8
Was in the chat room for that bi'ness and was trying to say the same thing (not as eloquently on the fly). Agree with Stu on this one (again, there was a theme that night). Setting up conflict for interesting story/narrative is *not* you vs. them imo. And, Hyve? You will, they will, everyone will embrace, it'll be awesome! Your preaching is breaking through to the other side where others (including mine) have no comprende'd, senor. I sense a disturbance in the force, and it'll be my-god-it's-full-of-stars. \m/ \m/ Not to be an adversarial forum poster or agree with Stork...cuz' I'm about too. I think there are games that lend themselves to having a hand wringing, maniacally cackling, nose and shifty eyes over the screen GM. Paranoia comes immediately to mind where your job as a GM is to kill the PCs and every single one of their six clones in increasingly creative and gruesome ways. Better yet is to have the players laser, grenade, stab, bludgeon and eviscerate the shit out of each other. And along the lines of what kainguru said about old school modules they were meant as a killy challenge and the 'game' aspect of those old school modules can be quite entertaining. Speaking of Paranoia I'm already considering "Paranoia: Dark Dungeons 2169 A.D. Jack Chick Hates Commies!" coming soon for Jackercon 2013 Part Deux.But when it comes to players developing interesting characters with detailed backstories and wanting an engaging, immersive plot...adversarial GMs tend to really wreck that shit. So if my players want challenges and drama but not a meat grinder... than I have to say in the immortal words of Joe Strummer quoting the Ramones... Hey Ho! Lets Go! Hey Ho! Lets Go! They're forming in a straight line They're going through a tight wind The kids are losing their minds The Blitzkrieg Bop They're piling in the back seat They're generating steam heat Pulsating to the back beat The Blitzkrieg Bop. Hey ho, let's go Shoot 'em in the back now What they want, I don't know Their all revved up and ready to go! Shitty recording but damn I would have loved to have been there. By the way I really love the really drinky pod casts. Where reading skills start to slip the laughter gets a tad bit wobbly and it just feels like "I'm hangin' at the pub wit me mates..."(even my written cockney accent sucks!) Cheers, Curt J.
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HyveMynd
Supporter
Dirty hippie, PbtA, Fate, & Cortex Prime <3er
Posts: 2,273
Preferred Game Systems: PbtA, Cortex Plus, Fate, Ubiquity
Currently Playing: Monsterhearts 2
Currently Running: The Sprawl
Favorite Species of Monkey: None
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Post by HyveMynd on Jul 22, 2013 21:33:06 GMT -8
Absolutely. Thistle pulling the javelin out, hurling it down the corridor and her unseen attacker, and somehow still tagging the 12-foot tall Amazonian warrior lurking around the corner was bad ass. I think my favorite moment what when Timothy Welkeen, Wizard for Hire, stepped into the pillar of flame room. Cue bad Christopher Walken voice. "I would like to discern the realities of what is going on inside this room. Oh. Apparently I now have a very large sword sprouting from my head."
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Post by evilgingerdm on Jul 23, 2013 5:14:33 GMT -8
Seriously! The trolls around here are pathetic. They really need to apply themselves more if they want to live up the the reputation of the internets. Trolling is a Art.
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Post by guitarspider on Jul 23, 2013 5:50:12 GMT -8
Yay for overturning national stereotypes. That said, the local con here is just too small for prereg, but it does have time-slots...
Also, just five years ago history students here would occasionally start brawls to figure out who would get to enter his name into the last spot of the course list. Because, you know, no online preregistration...
So I couldn't stop laughing when Stu said "Was ist das, preregistration?"
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Post by bloodsparrow on Jul 23, 2013 5:55:24 GMT -8
What GM could have foreseen the Druid shapeshifting into a rock, which is then thrown at a foe by the Bard, with the intention of crushing the poor guy when the Druid shapeshifts into a giant walrus in midair? You can't prepare for that, so why even bother? This needs to be on a t-shirt or coffee mug or SOMETHING.
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Post by bloodsparrow on Jul 23, 2013 6:02:17 GMT -8
No. Knitting is for bad-asses. Also because macramé doesn't use needles. Get your shit together.
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
Posts: 2,857
Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Jul 23, 2013 7:48:38 GMT -8
No. Knitting is for bad-asses. Also because macramé doesn't use needles. Get your shit together. Boom. Bloodsparrow has spoken.
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Post by hoseirrob on Jul 23, 2013 9:33:18 GMT -8
I think Stork, Dave, I were on the same page, but none of us (or based on the forum feedback) expressed it eloquently enough, so let me try again.
(this is a quick reply, so i don't want to go all the back and block text Hyvemind's example cheerleader so if you have questions, go to page 1) With the Cheerleader example, the GM put a potential hurdle or at the very least something the players have to deal with/acknowledge, etc) This isn't adversarial, but the players still have to "overcome" the hurdle or respond the pothole. What I was trying to (poorly) convey is that the players start out with a smooth road. The GM comes along and makes some bumps, twists, turns and potholes. The player wants all of these, because long drives on smooth roads leads to sleep, but the GM still puts the obstacles down.
It isn't adversarial and it is appreciated, but the players still have to "deal" with what is put in front of their smooth road.
Look man - it makes sense in my head.
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Post by CreativeCowboy on Jul 23, 2013 9:52:20 GMT -8
A GM (and a player in other roles) is adversarial when he plays [ against] the player and not [ to type] the character. The role of GM is adversarial in the context of push the PCs into taking action or to give them a nasty choice, pick a random name, make a snap decision about that NPCs personality, and get up in the PCs face.<snip> literally just made Brenda up on the spot, <snip> Maybe the player doesn't know why Brenda is so mad. Then it's my job as GM to make another snap decision.<snip> Regardless, I have no clue how this situation is going to play out. That's very AD&D 1e system: Reaction Table rolls (DMG p63) and tables of Personae of Non-Player Characters (DMG p100 - 102).
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Post by Kainguru on Jul 23, 2013 11:55:11 GMT -8
Was in the chat room for that bi'ness and was trying to say the same thing (not as eloquently on the fly). Agree with Stu on this one (again, there was a theme that night). Setting up conflict for interesting story/narrative is *not* you vs. them imo. And, Hyve? You will, they will, everyone will embrace, it'll be awesome! Your preaching is breaking through to the other side where others (including mine) have no comprende'd, senor. I sense a disturbance in the force, and it'll be my-god-it's-full-of-stars. \m/ \m/ Not to be an adversarial forum poster or agree with Stork...cuz' I'm about too. I think there are games that lend themselves to having a hand wringing, maniacally cackling, nose and shifty eyes over the screen GM. Paranoia comes immediately to mind where your job as a GM is to kill the PCs and every single one of their six clones in increasingly creative and gruesome ways. Better yet is to have the players laser, grenade, stab, bludgeon and eviscerate the shit out of each other. And along the lines of what kainguru said about old school modules they were meant as a killy challenge and the 'game' aspect of those old school modules can be quite entertaining. Speaking of Paranoia I'm already considering "Paranoia: Dark Dungeons 2169 A.D. Jack Chick Hates Commies!" coming soon for Jackercon 2013 Part Deux.But when it comes to players developing interesting characters with detailed backstories and wanting an engaging, immersive plot...adversarial GMs tend to really wreck that shit. So if my players want challenges and drama but not a meat grinder... than I have to say in the immortal words of Joe Strummer quoting the Ramones... Hey Ho! Lets Go! Hey Ho! Lets Go! They're forming in a straight line They're going through a tight wind The kids are losing their minds The Blitzkrieg Bop They're piling in the back seat They're generating steam heat Pulsating to the back beat The Blitzkrieg Bop. Hey ho, let's go Shoot 'em in the back now What they want, I don't know Their all revved up and ready to go! Shitty recording but damn I would have loved to have been there. By the way I really love the really drinky pod casts. Where reading skills start to slip the laughter gets a tad bit wobbly and it just feels like "I'm hangin' at the pub wit me mates..."(even my written cockney accent sucks!) Cheers, Curt J. Part Deux?
I'm going to bite the bullet (literally)
JUDGE DREDD - Unabridged and Uncut
. . . and cause we all like The Clash and Springsteen
Aaron
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Post by rickno7 on Jul 23, 2013 13:51:40 GMT -8
Wow... I make my first email, and specifically mention the lack of Claire and she shows up. I give up due to lack of relevancy. Next time complain about Ed McMahon never showing up to give you the publisher's clearing house check. That's a 2fer, a million dollars AND a zombie Ed McMahon
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Post by uselesstriviaman on Jul 23, 2013 20:21:07 GMT -8
Speaking of Paranoia I'm already considering "Paranoia: Dark Dungeons 2169 A.D. Jack Chick Hates Commies!" coming soon for Jackercon 2013 Part Deux.I'd like to go ahead and pre-pre-reg for that game. I have a theory about why so many players have difficulties letting go of the MurderDeathKill attitude of hack 'n slash gaming. In the earlier incarnations (2E and earlier) of Dungeons & Dragons, the only way to earn experience points was by killing monsters. It really wasn't until 3E that PCs could earn their XP by talking their way through an encounter, rather than slaughtering it.
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Post by guitarspider on Jul 23, 2013 22:13:46 GMT -8
For the younger players it's definitely video games. I like to call it red circle syndrome, because in BG you kill everything with a red circle, no matter what. Not that BG is solely responsible for it of course.
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Post by CreativeCowboy on Jul 23, 2013 22:29:03 GMT -8
I have a theory about why so many players have difficulties letting go of the MurderDeathKill attitude of hack 'n slash gaming. In the earlier incarnations (2E and earlier) of Dungeons & Dragons, the only way to earn experience points was by killing monsters [, collecting gold and finding an NPC mentor to train up - or for PCs to train up NPCs]. It really wasn't until 3E that PCs needed mechanics to urge them to talk their way through an [combat balanced] encounter, rather than slaughtering it. True. I recall my AD&D 1e games as being much more reliant on the social aspect of play than the 3.5 games I have since played. Less balance means players have to play with their minds more and with their weapons less. Not sure what other attitude is there to have in a hack 'n slash game though? Important to have the right GM for the right game.
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