fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 5:43:18 GMT -8
Just listening to the show, well done for getting it on line so quick Stu. But I take issue, with your learning no to have an obvious "leader" in a medieval game. There's always rank. As Dylan says " you gotta serve somebody". The challenge is for the players to learn to get their way within the system.
In Pendragon, one of our players is High King, and I'm a sixteen year old kid. In SoIaF, I'm a ships captain, but one of my fellow players is the son of the Lord of the House. In both those games I have agency, and change my superiors' mind, in SiOaF by starting pretty much everything I say with "It's not my place to say My Lord, but what about ..."
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D.T. Pints
Instigator
JACKERCON 2018: WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY June 22-July 1st
Posts: 2,857
Currently Playing: D&D 5e, Pathfinder, DUNGEONWORLD, Star Wars Edge of the Empire
Currently Running: DUNGEONWORLD, PATHFINDER
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Post by D.T. Pints on Feb 16, 2014 7:04:11 GMT -8
It would have to take some player buy in (to agree to "serve someone"). Some of my players would be immediately yelling "serve this!" But I could really enjoy being a bodyguard/court lackey to another player. It might give this immediate sense of character purpose and then meanwhile there could be so many other background storylines to deal with. "What ? A liason! But I have to prepare mi' lords bath! Oh all right I'm sure nothing unexpected will happen." As long as its not every game where the same douche bag player gets to be Lord High Buttcrackis (I actually had a character by this name, don't ask...ok it was RIFTS I'll admit it.) Cue sitcom music and you have "The Not So Fresh Duke of BellAire" (80's American sitcom reference). Better yet some brit douche bag named Bill said something like...(and I thought I was long winded...) How many thousands of my poorest subjects Are at this hour asleep! O sleep, O gentle sleep, Nature's soft nurse, how have I frightened thee, That thou no more will weigh my eyelids down, And steep my senses in forgetfulness? Why rather, sleep, liest thou in smoky cribs, Upon uneasy pallets stretching thee, And hush'd with buzzing night-flies to thy slumber, Than in the perfum'd chambers of the great, Under the canopies of costly state, And lull'd with sound of sweetest melody? O thou dull god, why liest thou with the vile In loathsome beds, and leav'st the kingly couch A watch-case or a common 'larum-bell? Wilt thou upon the high and giddy mast Seal up the ship-boy's eyes, and rock his brains In cradle of the rude imperious surge, And in the visitation of the winds, Who take the ruffian billows by the top, Curling their monstrous heads, and hanging them With deafing clamour in the slippery clouds, That with the hurly death itself awakes? Canst thou, O partial sleep, give thy repose To the wet sea-boy in an hour so rude; And in the calmest and most stillest night, With all appliances and means to boot, Deny it to a king? Then, happy low, lie down! Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown. Hey! do I get a prize for the first Shakespeare quote on the HJ forum ? (besides malifer bestowing yet another "nerd." award.) . I maaaaay have had too much coffee again. Someday druggeddwarf and I will run a co-gm'ed game called C&C "Coffee & Caffeine" where will just spout hours of box text descriptions at near light speed.
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Post by Kainguru on Feb 16, 2014 7:17:16 GMT -8
It would have to take some player buy in (to agree to "serve someone"). Some of my players would be immediately yelling "serve this!" Got the t-shirt while visiting that very locale . . . Aaron
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 7:43:29 GMT -8
We in the UK are indeed aware of the "Fresh Prince" But I stand by what I said, if you ain't serving somebody, you end up a Ronin or "murder-hobo'" and while that can be fun for a time, it turns out you don't get invited to the cool parties, or on the lootiest quests. Who was Bron before he met up with Tyrion? Where would Tyrion be without, his Dad, or even ugh, Joffrey? (Don't spoil me! I'm on TV time, not book time). But I will concede this. The group wherein we have the best power/service relationships is has been going on for (fuck how old am I?) about 36 years. Players earn a shit-tun of trust in that game, and that's probably why we realize that when a guy gets to be king, that's only in the game, and he still helps wash up at the end of the session. So, maybe Stu has a point at convention games, where a bunch of no-marks turn up to live out their fantasies of being Conan. Here, maybe, is not the place to say to one player, who might be the least able to command after all "you are in charge of the others." That's said, the patron the murder-hobos meet in the bar? The one with the quest? They're serving him, and they can probably do better. True fact, appertaining to that Queen's Caveliers game we heard a bit about. Who was the highest ranking servant in European royal courts in the 17th century? The Lord Chamberlain. Un-uh. The Groom of the Stool, the man who wiped the King's arse.
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druggeddwarf
Journeyman Douchebag
Posts: 167
Preferred Game Systems: Anything fun
Favorite Species of Monkey: The one that throws Kamehamehas.
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Post by druggeddwarf on Feb 16, 2014 9:57:31 GMT -8
I maaaaay have had too much coffee again. Someday druggeddwarf and I will run a co-gm'ed game called C&C "Coffee & Caffeine" where will just spout hours of box text descriptions at near light speed. You are so on your own bub. Also we got fresh prince in Ghana. Take that!
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Post by Stu Venable on Feb 16, 2014 10:29:01 GMT -8
My mind was specifically on con games, and that's what my comments were intended for.
A player with a character in a serving position in a campaign has plenty of time to figure out how to handle duties while still being their own person.
A con player has 4 hours.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 10:41:00 GMT -8
Yes, that what realized. After I posted. That's what you get for posting asylu listen. But it's a bugbear of mine.
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 11:03:23 GMT -8
Actually I have another bugbear. I can't recall who it was that played in a Lego dungeon, but I have to cornet them. The dungeon was made out of Lego. NOT "Legos". The collective plural of Lego is Lego. Go to the cinema, there's a film out about Lego, it's called The LEGO Movie. NOT the Legos movie. The actors voice the movie are (for the most part) American, never once do they say "Legos" so don't give me any crap about "it's a valid Americanism." It's not. Check out the last page of this handy-dandy presentation. See? It's not Legos!!!!
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 11:03:43 GMT -8
Rant over.
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sbloyd
Supporter
WHAT! A human in a Precursor service vehicle?!
Posts: 2,762
Preferred Game Systems: Storyteller; Dresden; Mage
Favorite Species of Monkey: Goddamnit, Curious George is a CHIMP not a monkey! Stop teaching my daughter improper classification!
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Post by sbloyd on Feb 16, 2014 11:43:55 GMT -8
But I love playing with Legos!
(smirk)
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fredrix
Master Douchebag
Posts: 2,142
Preferred Game Systems: Fate, L5R, Pendragon, Gumshoe, Feng Shui
Currently Playing: Pendragon, Song of Ice and Fire, L5R, Feng Shui, Traveller
Currently Running: Fate, Coriolis, Nights Black Agents
Favorite Species of Monkey: 1970's NTV, dubbed by the BBC (though The Water Margin beats it)
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Post by fredrix on Feb 16, 2014 12:34:00 GMT -8
But I love playing with Legos! (smirk) Gaahhh!
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maxinstuff
Supporter
Posts: 1,939
Preferred Game Systems: DCC RPG, Shadowrun 5e, Savage Worlds, GURPS 4e, HERO 6e, Mongoose Traveller
Favorite Species of Monkey: Proboscis
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Post by maxinstuff on Feb 16, 2014 13:52:53 GMT -8
We in the UK are indeed aware of the "Fresh Prince" My favourite episode is the one where he gets a job advertising shoes, but then robots try to kill him.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2014 15:56:31 GMT -8
I have good success with the concept of a "leader" player if we establish an understanding that the role comes with some added responsibility to act as a plot driver and maintain fairness to others at the table. It's not intended as a reward or power trip for the player in question, but the trick is to find someone who can handle the role in a manner that serves the story and the group.
The player ought to view it as an opportunity to take an interesting lead role in exchange for handing over a measure of normal character autonomy in order to further the game. It is pretty common in stories for a group of characters to act under the leadership of someone with more authority, who often serves to drive the plot. This method can add a layer of storytelling control if you can trust the player to keep the needs of the group in mind and occasionally act as a sort of quasi-NPC. Of course, convention gaming makes this trickier.
Anyway, I had a great time with Stork and Dave's Traveller game on Saturday and look forward to incorporating a richer character generation philosophy into my own games.
EDIT: I had written this response this morning and hadn't posted it until much later, so I missed Stu's clarification about con games.
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Post by fray on Feb 16, 2014 21:37:49 GMT -8
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Post by Kainguru on Feb 17, 2014 3:56:14 GMT -8
D.T. Pints - then one can get the other type of ruler, to whom the PC's are mere vassals, who provides the wonder and mystery: KUBLA KHAN (Or, a vision in a dream. A Fragment) In Xanadu did Kubla Khan A stately pleasure-dome decree: Where Alph, the sacred river, ran Through caverns measureless to man Down to a sunless sea. So twice five miles of fertile ground With walls and towers were girdled round; And there were gardens bright with sinuous rills, Where blossomed many an incense-bearing tree; And here were forests ancient as the hills, Enfolding sunny spots of greenery. But oh! that deep romantic chasm which slanted Down the green hill athwart a cedarn cover! A savage place! as holy and enchanted As e’er beneath a waning moon was haunted By woman wailing for her demon-lover! And from this chasm, with ceaseless turmoil seething, As if this earth in fast thick pants were breathing, A mighty fountain momently was forced: Amid whose swift half-intermitted burst Huge fragments vaulted like rebounding hail, Or chaffy grain beneath the thresher’s flail: And mid these dancing rocks at once and ever It flung up momently the sacred river. Five miles meandering with a mazy motion Through wood and dale the sacred river ran, Then reached the caverns measureless to man, And sank in tumult to a lifeless ocean; And ’mid this tumult Kubla heard from far Ancestral voices prophesying war! The shadow of the dome of pleasure Floated midway on the waves; Where was heard the mingled measure From the fountain and the caves. It was a miracle of rare device, A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice! A damsel with a dulcimer In a vision once I saw: It was an Abyssinian maid And on her dulcimer she played, Singing of Mount Abora. Could I revive within me Her symphony and song, To such a deep delight ’twould win me, That with music loud and long, I would build that dome in air, That sunny dome! those caves of ice! And all who heard should see them there, And all should cry, Beware! Beware! His flashing eyes, his floating hair! Weave a circle round him thrice, And close your eyes with holy dread For he on honey-dew hath fed, And drunk the milk of Paradise. I see your Shakespeare and raise you a Coleridge Taylor Aaron PS Kudos the first person to make a viable NPC from the Damsel with a Dulcimer . . .
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